1 00:01:01,614 --> 00:01:05,675 The National Rifle Association has produced a film 2 00:01:05,818 --> 00:01:08,378 which you are sure to find of great interest. 3 00:01:08,521 --> 00:01:10,921 Let's look at it. 4 00:01:11,057 --> 00:01:14,584 - It was the morning of April 20th, 1999. 5 00:01:14,727 --> 00:01:18,390 And it was pretty much like any other morning in America. 6 00:01:18,531 --> 00:01:23,093 The farmer did his chores, 7 00:01:23,236 --> 00:01:25,932 the milkman made his deliveries, 8 00:01:26,072 --> 00:01:28,233 the president bombed another country 9 00:01:28,374 --> 00:01:30,239 whose name we couldn't pronounce. 10 00:01:30,376 --> 00:01:31,900 Out in Fargo, North Dakota, 11 00:01:32,045 --> 00:01:35,606 Carry McWilliams went on his morning walk. 12 00:01:35,748 --> 00:01:38,546 Back in Michigan, Mrs. Hughes welcomed her students 13 00:01:38,685 --> 00:01:40,812 for another day of school. 14 00:01:40,954 --> 00:01:43,650 And out in a little town in Colorado, 15 00:01:43,790 --> 00:01:45,155 two boys went bowling 16 00:01:45,291 --> 00:01:47,759 at six in the morning. 17 00:01:47,894 --> 00:01:50,362 Yes, it was a typical day in the United States 18 00:01:50,496 --> 00:01:52,464 of America. 19 00:01:55,168 --> 00:01:56,863 - Can I help you? - Uh, yeah, 20 00:01:58,237 --> 00:01:59,864 I'm here to open up an account. 21 00:02:00,006 --> 00:02:01,769 - Okay, what type of account would you like? 22 00:02:01,908 --> 00:02:05,105 - Um, I want the account where I can, uh, get the free gun. 23 00:02:05,244 --> 00:02:06,609 - Okay. 24 00:02:06,746 --> 00:02:09,112 - I'd spotted an ad in the local Michigan paper 25 00:02:09,248 --> 00:02:11,773 that said if you opened an account at North Country Bank, 26 00:02:11,918 --> 00:02:14,284 the bank would give you a gun. - You do a CD 27 00:02:14,420 --> 00:02:16,354 and we'll hand you a gun. 28 00:02:16,489 --> 00:02:20,220 We have a whole brochure here that you can look at. 29 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,191 Once we do the background check and everything, 30 00:02:22,328 --> 00:02:24,888 it's yours to go. - Okay. Well, all right, 31 00:02:25,031 --> 00:02:26,999 well, that's the account I'd like to open. 32 00:02:27,133 --> 00:02:30,296 We have a vault, which at all times we keep at least 33 00:02:30,436 --> 00:02:31,903 500 firearms. - Five-hundred of these, 34 00:02:32,038 --> 00:02:33,733 you have in your vault? - In our vault. 35 00:02:33,873 --> 00:02:35,238 - Wow. 36 00:02:35,375 --> 00:02:36,740 - We have to do a background check. 37 00:02:36,876 --> 00:02:38,741 - At the bank here? - At the bank, 38 00:02:38,878 --> 00:02:40,743 which we are a licensed firearm dealer. 39 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:43,348 - Oh, you are? You're a bank and a licensed firearm dealer. 40 00:02:43,483 --> 00:02:46,145 What do I put for "race"? White or Caucasian or...? 41 00:02:46,285 --> 00:02:48,082 - Caucasian. - Caucasian. 42 00:02:48,221 --> 00:02:53,090 - I knew you were gonna make me spell the... Cau-ca-sian. 43 00:02:53,226 --> 00:02:55,751 Is that right? - Yes. 44 00:02:55,895 --> 00:02:59,991 I don't think that's the part they're gonna be worried about. 45 00:03:00,133 --> 00:03:02,101 "Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective 46 00:03:02,235 --> 00:03:04,567 or have you ever been committed to a mental institution?" 47 00:03:04,704 --> 00:03:06,535 I've never been committed to a mental institution. 48 00:03:06,673 --> 00:03:08,038 What does that mean, 49 00:03:08,174 --> 00:03:10,438 "Have I ever been adjudicated mentally defective"? 50 00:03:10,576 --> 00:03:12,942 - It would be something involved with a crime. 51 00:03:13,079 --> 00:03:15,445 So if I'm just normally mentally defective but not criminal... 52 00:03:15,581 --> 00:03:16,946 - Yeah, exactly. 53 00:03:17,083 --> 00:03:20,382 - There you go, Mike. - Okay. Thank you very much. Wow. 54 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:22,886 - I had one personally-- - That's a nice tension. 55 00:03:23,022 --> 00:03:25,081 - It is and it's a straight-shooter, 56 00:03:25,224 --> 00:03:26,714 let me tell ya. 57 00:03:29,328 --> 00:03:31,626 - Wow. Sweet. 58 00:03:31,764 --> 00:03:34,062 Well, here's my first question: You think 59 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:36,395 it's a little dangerous, handing out guns in a bank? 60 00:04:22,882 --> 00:04:25,976 - Ten-ho! 61 00:04:26,119 --> 00:04:28,917 - Each gun makes lots of battle sounds. 62 00:04:29,055 --> 00:04:32,252 Just press the trigger, and listen. 63 00:04:32,391 --> 00:04:34,154 - That sounds like a gun battle. Over there. 64 00:04:34,293 --> 00:04:36,761 - Is it real? - Looks like real! 65 00:04:36,896 --> 00:04:39,524 Hey, it sounds like real! 66 00:04:39,665 --> 00:04:43,032 - Right! The Sound-O-Power military and western rifles 67 00:04:43,169 --> 00:04:44,534 by Marx! 68 00:04:44,670 --> 00:04:47,662 - This was my first gun. 69 00:04:47,807 --> 00:04:51,675 I couldn't wait to go outside and shoot up the neighbourhood. 70 00:04:51,811 --> 00:04:54,302 Those were the days. "I was born 71 00:04:54,447 --> 00:04:56,847 "in Michigan 72 00:04:56,983 --> 00:04:59,781 "and I wish and wish again that I was back 73 00:04:59,919 --> 00:05:02,649 "in the town where I was born" 74 00:05:02,789 --> 00:05:04,552 - By the time I was a teenager, 75 00:05:04,690 --> 00:05:06,055 I was such a good shot 76 00:05:06,192 --> 00:05:08,387 I won the National Rifle Association's 77 00:05:08,528 --> 00:05:10,962 Markman award. You see, 78 00:05:11,097 --> 00:05:12,462 I grew up in Michigan, 79 00:05:12,598 --> 00:05:14,293 a gun-lover's paradise. 80 00:05:14,433 --> 00:05:16,367 And so did this man, 81 00:05:16,502 --> 00:05:19,027 the Oscar-winning actor and president 82 00:05:19,172 --> 00:05:21,868 of the National Rifle Association, 83 00:05:22,008 --> 00:05:23,703 Mr. Charlton Heston. 84 00:05:27,446 --> 00:05:29,209 We come from a state where everyone 85 00:05:29,348 --> 00:05:31,908 loves to go hunting. 86 00:05:32,051 --> 00:05:33,541 - Hah. - Even the dogs. 87 00:05:33,686 --> 00:05:37,144 - There were actually two of the hunters at camp. 88 00:05:37,290 --> 00:05:38,655 They thought they'd get a few pictures 89 00:05:38,791 --> 00:05:40,725 of the dog dressed up as a hunter 90 00:05:40,860 --> 00:05:42,987 to kind of just have some fun around camp. 91 00:05:43,129 --> 00:05:45,154 And one of the guys had the idea that, 92 00:05:45,298 --> 00:05:47,562 "Why don't we sling a rifle on the dog's back 93 00:05:47,700 --> 00:05:50,828 to make the pictures a little more interesting. 94 00:05:50,970 --> 00:05:53,530 The victim was kneeling down in front of the dog 95 00:05:53,673 --> 00:05:55,641 when the weapon slipped. 96 00:05:55,775 --> 00:05:58,903 The one round went through the victim's shin, 97 00:05:59,045 --> 00:06:00,410 the right part of his shin, 98 00:06:00,546 --> 00:06:02,605 and came out through the back of his calf. 99 00:06:02,748 --> 00:06:06,240 - Was the dog hauled off for any period of time by the police? 100 00:06:06,385 --> 00:06:08,080 - No, it wasn't. No. 101 00:06:08,221 --> 00:06:12,089 Um, in Michigan, the law basically states 102 00:06:12,225 --> 00:06:14,420 that people can commit crimes that animals 103 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:17,688 aren't some... form of, uh, you know, 104 00:06:17,830 --> 00:06:19,195 whatever that can commit a crime. 105 00:06:19,332 --> 00:06:20,697 - An animal cannot commit a crime 106 00:06:20,833 --> 00:06:22,926 or be charged with a crime in this state. 107 00:06:23,069 --> 00:06:25,469 - Exactly. - Is it possible that the dog 108 00:06:25,605 --> 00:06:28,540 knew what it was doing? - That, I don't know. 109 00:06:28,674 --> 00:06:30,767 I really wouldn't be able to tell you that. 110 00:06:30,910 --> 00:06:33,037 The dog was cute dressed up as a hunter, 111 00:06:33,179 --> 00:06:35,613 there's no doubt about it. I mean, it was a funny picture, 112 00:06:35,748 --> 00:06:37,875 um, you know, to look at. 113 00:06:38,017 --> 00:06:39,985 It was... it was kind of neat. 114 00:06:41,854 --> 00:06:44,721 - Yup, this was the kind of place I was from. 115 00:06:44,857 --> 00:06:46,324 A box 116 00:06:46,459 --> 00:06:48,427 of 270s. - Coming up. 117 00:06:51,330 --> 00:06:52,729 There you go. - Perfect. 118 00:06:56,135 --> 00:06:58,569 Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. 119 00:06:58,704 --> 00:07:00,228 Sorry about that, sorry. 120 00:07:00,339 --> 00:07:01,670 - So I've been discharged. 121 00:07:01,774 --> 00:07:03,799 - You don't need no gun control. You know what you need? 122 00:07:06,045 --> 00:07:08,411 We need some bullet control. 123 00:07:08,547 --> 00:07:11,414 We need to control the bullets, that's right. 124 00:07:11,550 --> 00:07:15,042 I think all bullets should cost $5,000. 125 00:07:15,187 --> 00:07:17,747 $5,000 for a bullet. You know why? 126 00:07:17,890 --> 00:07:20,256 'Cause if a bullet cost $5,000, 127 00:07:20,393 --> 00:07:22,691 there'd be no more innocent bystanders. 128 00:07:22,828 --> 00:07:24,693 [ clapping and cheering ] 129 00:07:24,830 --> 00:07:26,457 Every time 130 00:07:26,599 --> 00:07:27,998 somebody get shot, people are, 131 00:07:28,134 --> 00:07:30,432 "Damn, he must've did something." 132 00:07:30,569 --> 00:07:33,561 See, they put $50,000's worth of bullets in his ass!" 133 00:07:37,443 --> 00:07:40,037 And people'd think before they killed somebody 134 00:07:40,179 --> 00:07:42,044 for a bullet that cost $5,000! 135 00:07:42,181 --> 00:07:44,308 "Man, I would blow your fucking head off -- 136 00:07:44,450 --> 00:07:46,418 if I could afford it." 137 00:07:49,689 --> 00:07:51,884 I'm gonna get me another job, 138 00:07:52,024 --> 00:07:55,721 I'm gonna start saving some money, and you a dead man. 139 00:07:55,861 --> 00:07:59,797 You better hope I can't get no bullets on layaway. 140 00:08:02,101 --> 00:08:04,763 - Not far from where Charlton Heston and I grew up 141 00:08:04,837 --> 00:08:08,136 is a training ground for the Michigan Militia. 142 00:08:08,274 --> 00:08:09,639 Why do you use the bowling pins? 143 00:08:09,775 --> 00:08:12,903 - From a self-defence or whatever tactical standpoint, 144 00:08:13,045 --> 00:08:14,740 it's a small target, which also represents 145 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,906 the vitals on a... on a human being, 146 00:08:18,050 --> 00:08:19,517 if you ever had to shoot at one. 147 00:08:21,787 --> 00:08:25,382 - The Michigan Militia became known around the world 148 00:08:25,524 --> 00:08:29,551 when, on April 19th, 1995, two guys living in Michigan 149 00:08:29,695 --> 00:08:31,356 who had attended Militia meetings, 150 00:08:31,497 --> 00:08:32,930 Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols, 151 00:08:33,065 --> 00:08:34,862 blew up the federal building 152 00:08:35,001 --> 00:08:37,731 in Oklahoma City, 153 00:08:37,870 --> 00:08:40,202 killing 168 people. 154 00:08:40,339 --> 00:08:42,364 The Michigan Militia wanted everyone to know 155 00:08:42,508 --> 00:08:45,875 that they were nothing like McVeigh and Nichols. 156 00:08:46,012 --> 00:08:47,377 - This is an American tradition. 157 00:08:47,513 --> 00:08:50,038 It's an American responsibility to be armed. 158 00:08:50,182 --> 00:08:52,548 If you're not armed, you're not responsible. 159 00:08:52,685 --> 00:08:55,051 Who's gonna defend your kids, the cops? 160 00:08:55,187 --> 00:08:58,384 The federal government? No, none of them. 161 00:08:58,524 --> 00:09:01,049 It's your job to defend you and yours. 162 00:09:01,193 --> 00:09:03,855 If you don't do it, you're in dereliction of duty, 163 00:09:03,996 --> 00:09:06,226 as an American. Period. 164 00:09:06,365 --> 00:09:08,424 - We're here to let them know we're here to help. 165 00:09:08,567 --> 00:09:10,398 We're not the bogeymen we're made out to be. 166 00:09:10,536 --> 00:09:12,868 We're here to help and defend the people of this country. 167 00:09:13,005 --> 00:09:15,064 - I'm sure you guys are the kind of people 168 00:09:15,207 --> 00:09:17,232 that people would like to have as their neighbour. 169 00:09:17,376 --> 00:09:19,401 If somebody's in need, you're there to help them. 170 00:09:19,545 --> 00:09:21,911 - Pretty much. We're all normal people. We all have regular jobs 171 00:09:22,048 --> 00:09:24,175 and this is what we do on our time. 172 00:09:24,316 --> 00:09:26,910 - What kind of a job do you have? - I'm a draftsman. 173 00:09:27,053 --> 00:09:29,146 - How about you? - Unemployed right now. 174 00:09:29,288 --> 00:09:31,085 - Frank, what do you do for a living? 175 00:09:31,223 --> 00:09:32,588 - I work for a heat trading company. 176 00:09:32,725 --> 00:09:34,920 I drive a truck for 'em. - Okay. How about you? 177 00:09:35,061 --> 00:09:39,589 - I'm a real-estate negotiator - Real-estate negotiator! 178 00:09:39,732 --> 00:09:41,757 - White collar all the way. 179 00:09:41,901 --> 00:09:43,926 - You don't bring that with you, though, do you, 180 00:09:44,070 --> 00:09:45,435 when you're negotiating the real estate? 181 00:09:45,571 --> 00:09:47,163 - No. 182 00:09:47,306 --> 00:09:48,671 - Where do you live, in suburban-- 183 00:09:48,808 --> 00:09:50,173 - Westland. - So what do you have 184 00:09:50,309 --> 00:09:52,607 in your home? - Smith & Wesson 9-millimetre. 185 00:09:52,745 --> 00:09:54,144 - Nine-millimetre? - Yeah. 186 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:55,645 - And how about you? - With hollow points. 187 00:09:55,781 --> 00:09:57,146 - Twelve gage. 188 00:09:57,283 --> 00:09:58,648 - Twelve gage at home? - Yeah. 189 00:09:58,784 --> 00:10:00,149 - How about you? - M-16. 190 00:10:00,286 --> 00:10:01,651 - At home? - Yeah. 191 00:10:01,787 --> 00:10:03,345 At the ready. - I don't agree with that, 192 00:10:03,489 --> 00:10:05,684 'cause you gotta worry about where your arms are going. 193 00:10:05,825 --> 00:10:09,693 - I know where they're gonna go when I aim and shoot. 194 00:10:09,829 --> 00:10:12,093 - Whose idea was the calendar? 195 00:10:12,231 --> 00:10:15,098 - That'd probably be Christian. 196 00:10:15,234 --> 00:10:18,101 - A picture's worth 1,000 words. A) it demonstrates a level 197 00:10:18,237 --> 00:10:20,569 of sophistication that you wouldn't expect out of Militia; 198 00:10:20,706 --> 00:10:23,334 B) you know, 199 00:10:23,476 --> 00:10:25,603 we're people too. - Right. 200 00:10:25,744 --> 00:10:27,769 - And we have a lot of fun with it. 201 00:10:27,913 --> 00:10:29,278 - Right. - There was a fundraiser. 202 00:10:29,415 --> 00:10:32,316 It showed, um, that we're not so serious, you know. 203 00:10:32,451 --> 00:10:34,919 We're not these conspiracy nuts who wouldn't want our pictures 204 00:10:35,054 --> 00:10:39,047 to get out. The idea... it was a fundraiser, you know... 205 00:10:39,191 --> 00:10:42,524 - I've had guns, um... 206 00:10:42,661 --> 00:10:44,891 pretty much since I was old enough to... 207 00:10:45,030 --> 00:10:49,694 to have them. And I learned how to use them, um... 208 00:10:49,835 --> 00:10:51,427 You're silly! 209 00:10:51,570 --> 00:10:54,539 Uh, because being a female, number one, 210 00:10:54,673 --> 00:10:57,073 I felt it was important to be able to protect myself 211 00:10:57,209 --> 00:10:58,801 with the best means possible. 212 00:10:58,944 --> 00:11:01,071 And one of those means is having a gun. 213 00:11:01,213 --> 00:11:02,976 When a criminal breaks into your house, 214 00:11:03,115 --> 00:11:04,878 who's the first person you're gonna call? 215 00:11:05,017 --> 00:11:08,953 Most people will call the police because they have guns. 216 00:11:09,088 --> 00:11:13,616 Cut out the middleman. Take care of your own family yourself. 217 00:11:13,759 --> 00:11:18,219 If you're not going to protect your family, who is? 218 00:11:18,364 --> 00:11:20,662 - We're not racist, we're not extremist, 219 00:11:20,799 --> 00:11:23,893 we're not fundamentalist, we're not terrorists or militants 220 00:11:24,036 --> 00:11:26,561 or other such nonsense. - We're citizens. 221 00:11:26,705 --> 00:11:30,106 - We're just concerned citizens. We have a desire 222 00:11:30,242 --> 00:11:32,176 to fulfil our responsibilities and duties as Americans, 223 00:11:32,311 --> 00:11:35,109 and armed citizenry is part of that. 224 00:11:40,319 --> 00:11:43,846 - What do you grow here? - Right now, there's tofu beans, 225 00:11:46,392 --> 00:11:48,223 soy beans. Tofu-soy beans. 226 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,420 - You're a tofu farmer. - Yeah. Yeah, food farmer. 227 00:11:51,564 --> 00:11:53,054 I'm a food farmer. - Food. 228 00:11:53,199 --> 00:11:55,793 - I grow food for people to eat. 229 00:11:55,935 --> 00:11:58,768 No herbicides, no pesticides on that stuff. 230 00:11:58,904 --> 00:12:01,134 - Right. All natural. - Right. 231 00:12:01,273 --> 00:12:03,503 - Yeah. Better. - Certified organic. 232 00:12:03,642 --> 00:12:05,303 - Uh-huh. Healthier. - Yeah. 233 00:12:05,444 --> 00:12:06,809 Basically, yeah. 234 00:12:06,946 --> 00:12:10,438 This is James Nichols, the brother of Terry Nichols. 235 00:12:10,583 --> 00:12:13,609 James graduated from high school the same year I did, 236 00:12:13,752 --> 00:12:15,151 in the district next to mine. 237 00:12:15,287 --> 00:12:17,755 On this farm in Decker, Michigan, 238 00:12:17,890 --> 00:12:20,324 McVeigh and the Nichols brothers made practice bombs 239 00:12:20,459 --> 00:12:23,292 before Oklahoma City. 240 00:12:23,429 --> 00:12:25,556 Terry and James were both arrested in connection 241 00:12:25,698 --> 00:12:27,723 to the bombing. [ TV news ]: U.S. attorneys 242 00:12:27,866 --> 00:12:30,460 formally linked the Nichols brothers of Michigan 243 00:12:30,603 --> 00:12:32,503 with Oklahoma bomb suspect Timothy McVeigh. 244 00:12:32,638 --> 00:12:34,401 Officials charged James, who was at the hearing, 245 00:12:34,540 --> 00:12:37,236 and Terry, who was not, with conspiring 246 00:12:37,376 --> 00:12:39,901 to make and possess small bombs. 247 00:12:40,045 --> 00:12:43,071 - Terry Nichols was convicted and received a life sentence. 248 00:12:43,215 --> 00:12:46,981 Timothy McVeigh was executed. But the feds 249 00:12:47,119 --> 00:12:48,950 didn't have the goods on James, 250 00:12:49,088 --> 00:12:52,057 so the charges were dropped. - I'm just glad 251 00:12:52,191 --> 00:12:55,092 to be out and free, so I can get on with my life. 252 00:12:55,227 --> 00:12:56,592 - Did Timothy McVeigh ever stay here? 253 00:12:56,729 --> 00:12:59,755 - Yes. Yes. He stayed here several times. 254 00:12:59,898 --> 00:13:02,628 For the longest period, about three months or so, I dunno. 255 00:13:02,768 --> 00:13:04,258 But, uh, he was a nice guy. 256 00:13:04,403 --> 00:13:06,166 - Decent guy? - Oh, yeah. 257 00:13:06,305 --> 00:13:07,670 - They didn't find anything on this farm. 258 00:13:07,806 --> 00:13:09,171 - As to what, 259 00:13:09,308 --> 00:13:11,173 bomb-making material? - Any kind of explosives. 260 00:13:11,310 --> 00:13:14,768 - Uh, yeah, I had blasting caps, dynamite blasting caps, 261 00:13:14,913 --> 00:13:17,108 dynamite fuse, black powder, you know? 262 00:13:17,249 --> 00:13:19,444 For muzzle loaders and... Sure. 263 00:13:19,585 --> 00:13:23,077 Diesel fuel, fertilizer, but, uh, that is normal farm stuff 264 00:13:23,222 --> 00:13:26,453 that is no way connected any way whatsoever to, uh, 265 00:13:26,592 --> 00:13:29,026 the Oklahoma City bombing or bomb making. 266 00:13:29,161 --> 00:13:32,722 Them people - law enforcement, if you wanna call 'em that - 267 00:13:32,865 --> 00:13:36,062 were here and they were shaking in their shoes. 268 00:13:36,201 --> 00:13:39,398 They were physically shaking. Scared to death. 269 00:13:39,538 --> 00:13:40,903 - Of? 270 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:43,565 - Because they thought this was gonna be another Waco. 271 00:13:43,709 --> 00:13:47,076 Because certain people... 272 00:13:47,212 --> 00:13:50,045 namely my ex-wife and other people, 273 00:13:50,182 --> 00:13:53,242 said I'm a radical, I'm a wild man, 274 00:13:53,385 --> 00:13:56,912 I got a gun under every arm, down every leg and every shoe, 275 00:13:57,056 --> 00:13:58,421 every corner of the house. 276 00:13:58,557 --> 00:14:01,390 You say anything to me, I'll shoot ya. 277 00:14:01,527 --> 00:14:04,553 If the people find out how they've been ripped off 278 00:14:04,697 --> 00:14:09,760 and... and enslaved in this country by the government, 279 00:14:09,902 --> 00:14:14,601 by the powers-to-be... 280 00:14:14,740 --> 00:14:18,938 they will revolt, with anger, 281 00:14:19,078 --> 00:14:21,273 with merciless anger. 282 00:14:21,413 --> 00:14:23,404 There'll be blood running in the streets. 283 00:14:23,549 --> 00:14:25,312 When a government turns tyrannical, 284 00:14:25,451 --> 00:14:28,579 it is your duty to overthrow it. 285 00:14:28,721 --> 00:14:30,086 - Well, why not use Gandhi's way? 286 00:14:30,222 --> 00:14:31,712 He didn't have any guns, 287 00:14:31,857 --> 00:14:33,654 and he beat the British empire. 288 00:14:33,792 --> 00:14:36,260 - I'm not familiar with that. 289 00:14:40,566 --> 00:14:42,158 - Oscoda has a bad habit of raising psychos. 290 00:14:42,267 --> 00:14:43,632 Bad habit of it. 291 00:14:43,769 --> 00:14:45,259 - This is Brent. 292 00:14:45,404 --> 00:14:48,066 And this is his buddy DJ. 293 00:14:48,207 --> 00:14:49,902 They live in Oscoda, Michigan, 294 00:14:50,042 --> 00:14:51,907 across the bay from the Nichols farm. 295 00:14:52,044 --> 00:14:53,409 Eric Harris, 296 00:14:53,545 --> 00:14:55,410 who would later go on to commit the massacre 297 00:14:55,547 --> 00:14:57,412 at Columbine High School in Colorado, 298 00:14:57,549 --> 00:14:58,914 spent part of his childhood here. 299 00:14:59,051 --> 00:15:03,715 Eric lived on the air-force base in Oscoda, 300 00:15:03,856 --> 00:15:07,121 where his dad flew planes during the Gulf War. 301 00:15:07,259 --> 00:15:09,921 Twenty percent of all the bombs dropped in that war 302 00:15:10,062 --> 00:15:13,122 were from planes that took off from Oscoda. 303 00:15:13,265 --> 00:15:16,428 I asked Brent if he remembered anything about Eric. 304 00:15:16,568 --> 00:15:18,593 - I never knew him, but I knew of him. 305 00:15:18,737 --> 00:15:21,433 He left here before I got here. I've only lived here seven years 306 00:15:21,573 --> 00:15:23,541 off and on. - He was about the same age 307 00:15:23,675 --> 00:15:25,870 as you, so you must have people in your class-- 308 00:15:26,011 --> 00:15:28,673 - A friend of mine knows him, he was in class with him. 309 00:15:28,814 --> 00:15:30,611 He's lived here all his life. 310 00:15:30,749 --> 00:15:33,377 - I went to school with him and it shocked me to hear it 311 00:15:33,519 --> 00:15:35,043 on the news. 312 00:15:35,187 --> 00:15:39,283 That especially a kid from here would be doing that. 313 00:15:39,425 --> 00:15:41,222 - I didn't last too long in high school. 314 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:42,725 I got kicked out, I got expelled. 315 00:15:42,861 --> 00:15:45,227 - Why was that? - I had a run-in with a kid 316 00:15:45,364 --> 00:15:48,731 one time and I pulled a weapon on him, I pulled a gun on him. 317 00:15:48,867 --> 00:15:50,357 - What kind of gun? - Nine-millimetre. 318 00:15:50,502 --> 00:15:52,697 I could've made a mess out of that situation. 319 00:15:52,838 --> 00:15:54,738 - Could've been worse. - Could've been a lot worse. 320 00:15:54,873 --> 00:15:56,534 - Could've been Eric Harris. - It could've been. 321 00:15:56,675 --> 00:15:58,939 - So they kicked you out? - Yeah, they kicked me out 322 00:15:59,077 --> 00:16:03,207 for 380 days or 165 days, whatever a full school year is. 323 00:16:03,348 --> 00:16:06,715 - For the longest time, that's what my plan was, to move out 324 00:16:06,852 --> 00:16:08,945 to Colorado. - Colorado? 325 00:16:09,087 --> 00:16:11,487 - 'Cause I've got family out there. 326 00:16:11,623 --> 00:16:13,818 Matter of fact, one of my uncles is a janitor 327 00:16:13,959 --> 00:16:15,324 for Columbine School. 328 00:16:15,461 --> 00:16:16,826 - Really? - Yeah. 329 00:16:16,962 --> 00:16:19,396 - After Columbine, what was it like here in Oscoda? 330 00:16:19,531 --> 00:16:21,556 - My name was second-highest on the bomb list, 331 00:16:21,700 --> 00:16:24,692 because of the reputation you get in this town. 332 00:16:24,837 --> 00:16:27,362 - Why? You mean they did a list of-- 333 00:16:27,506 --> 00:16:29,531 - Of suspects. - Of students who potentially-- 334 00:16:29,675 --> 00:16:31,199 - Yeah. - ...would call in a bomb threat 335 00:16:31,343 --> 00:16:32,708 after Columbine? - Yes. 336 00:16:32,845 --> 00:16:34,710 - And you were number two on the list? 337 00:16:34,847 --> 00:16:37,042 - I was second or third on the list, yeah. 338 00:16:37,182 --> 00:16:40,709 - Why is that? - Because the whole fact is, 339 00:16:40,853 --> 00:16:43,378 like I said, this town really gets people down. 340 00:16:43,522 --> 00:16:45,888 - Yeah, but why did they single you out? 341 00:16:46,024 --> 00:16:50,051 - Because I was a troubled kid. - You were in trouble in school? 342 00:16:50,195 --> 00:16:52,095 - Oh, yeah. Why did they put you 343 00:16:52,231 --> 00:16:54,722 number two on their list, after Columbine, 344 00:16:54,867 --> 00:16:58,564 of the students that could be a threat? 345 00:16:58,704 --> 00:17:01,537 Come on, there must be a reason. - Well, okay. The thing is, 346 00:17:01,673 --> 00:17:04,073 I have a thing, it's called the "Anarchist Cookbook." 347 00:17:04,209 --> 00:17:06,939 It shows you how to make bombs and stuff like that. 348 00:17:07,079 --> 00:17:08,876 If there's anything that went wrong, 349 00:17:09,014 --> 00:17:10,743 they're gonna come to me first. 350 00:17:10,883 --> 00:17:13,249 And I don't need that. - Just 'cause you owned a copy 351 00:17:13,385 --> 00:17:15,410 of the book? - Just because I own a copy-- 352 00:17:15,554 --> 00:17:18,921 - Never made a bomb yourself? - No. Oh, I've made 'em. 353 00:17:19,057 --> 00:17:21,582 It was nothing big; it wasn't even as big as a pipe bomb. 354 00:17:21,727 --> 00:17:24,025 It was just... some make it like a little tennis-ball bomb 355 00:17:24,162 --> 00:17:25,561 or something like that. 356 00:17:27,833 --> 00:17:31,792 Out of the "Anarchist Cookbook," the latest thing I built... 357 00:17:31,937 --> 00:17:34,531 I think, would have to be... I think I made it, like, 358 00:17:34,673 --> 00:17:38,370 about a good five-gallon drum of napalm. 359 00:17:38,510 --> 00:17:41,411 You know, homemade napalm. 360 00:17:41,547 --> 00:17:42,912 - Kids knew that you were doing this? 361 00:17:43,048 --> 00:17:44,879 - Yeah. - So you were number two, then, 362 00:17:45,017 --> 00:17:46,382 on the list. - Right. 363 00:17:46,518 --> 00:17:48,383 - Who was number one? - I don't know. 364 00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:52,047 They never told me that name. Which kind of made me mad. 365 00:17:52,190 --> 00:17:54,715 'Cause I didn't make it to number one. 366 00:17:54,860 --> 00:17:57,385 I know it's kind of silly, but I guess 367 00:17:57,529 --> 00:18:01,226 it'd been kind of an ego thing, knowing that I was number one 368 00:18:01,366 --> 00:18:04,802 at something in Oscoda, even if it was a bomb-threat list. 369 00:18:04,937 --> 00:18:06,802 - Do you believe it was right 370 00:18:06,939 --> 00:18:09,237 to blow up the building in Oklahoma City? 371 00:18:09,374 --> 00:18:11,569 I'm not saying you did it. - No. No, no, no. 372 00:18:11,710 --> 00:18:14,076 - I'm just saying: was it right? - Why was it "blowed up"? 373 00:18:14,212 --> 00:18:16,476 That's a good question. Why was that building "blowed up"? 374 00:18:16,615 --> 00:18:19,413 And who blew it up? - But if someone did it, 375 00:18:19,551 --> 00:18:21,075 it would be wrong. - Yeah. 376 00:18:21,219 --> 00:18:23,687 - It is wrong to take the lives of those people. 377 00:18:23,822 --> 00:18:26,120 - Yeah. 378 00:18:26,258 --> 00:18:30,524 I use the pen. 'Cause the pen is mightier than the sword. 379 00:18:30,662 --> 00:18:35,156 But you always must keep a sword handy, for when the pen fails. 380 00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:38,497 I sleep with a .44 Magnum under my pillow. 381 00:18:38,637 --> 00:18:41,868 - Come on... That's what everyone says. 382 00:18:42,007 --> 00:18:44,032 Is that true? - It's true. 383 00:18:44,176 --> 00:18:46,371 - If we were to go-- - The whole world knows that. 384 00:18:46,511 --> 00:18:49,537 - ...look under your pillow right now, would we see a .44 Magnum? 385 00:18:49,681 --> 00:18:51,205 - Yeah. - Honestly? 386 00:18:51,350 --> 00:18:54,012 Would you take us and show us? Right now? 387 00:18:54,152 --> 00:18:56,518 He took me into his bedroom, but told the cameraman 388 00:18:56,655 --> 00:18:58,350 to stay out. Sure enough, 389 00:18:58,490 --> 00:19:01,550 there was a .44 Magnum under his pillow. 390 00:19:01,693 --> 00:19:03,888 There it is. Okay. Is it loaded? 391 00:19:04,029 --> 00:19:05,496 - Aye-yay-yay. 392 00:19:05,564 --> 00:19:07,327 - Okay. I believe you. 393 00:19:07,399 --> 00:19:10,334 NICHOLS HAS COCKED THE GUN AND PUT IT TO HIS TEMPLE. 394 00:19:10,402 --> 00:19:12,700 [ laughing ] Don't do that! 395 00:19:12,771 --> 00:19:14,466 You put the gun to your head. - I know! 396 00:19:14,606 --> 00:19:16,801 - Jeez! - I'm not gonna get hurt! 397 00:19:16,942 --> 00:19:19,672 - This is loaded. - It's loaded, it's safe. 398 00:19:19,811 --> 00:19:22,746 You've got to pull the trigger, pull the hammer and shoot it. 399 00:19:22,881 --> 00:19:25,748 - Mm, put the hammer back. - No one has a right to tell me 400 00:19:25,884 --> 00:19:28,444 that I can't have it. That is protected 401 00:19:28,587 --> 00:19:30,748 in our constitution. - Where's it say a handgun 402 00:19:30,889 --> 00:19:32,754 is protected? - No, gun. We should... 403 00:19:32,891 --> 00:19:34,415 Every citizen-- - It doesn't say "gun"! 404 00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:36,424 It says "arms." - Arms. What is arms? 405 00:19:36,561 --> 00:19:38,756 - Could be a nuclear weapon. - It's not these-- That's right, 406 00:19:38,897 --> 00:19:41,263 it could be a nuclear weapon! - You think you should have 407 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:43,766 the right to have weapons-grade plutonium here on the farm? 408 00:19:43,902 --> 00:19:45,267 - We should be able to have anything-- 409 00:19:45,404 --> 00:19:46,769 - Should you have weapons-grade plutonium? 410 00:19:46,905 --> 00:19:49,100 - I don't want it. - But should you have the right 411 00:19:49,241 --> 00:19:51,607 to have it if you did want it? - That should be restricted. 412 00:19:51,743 --> 00:19:54,234 - Ah! Ah, so you do believe in some restrictions. 413 00:19:54,379 --> 00:19:58,281 - Well, there's wackos out there. 414 00:19:58,417 --> 00:20:01,443 "Happiness is a warm gun 415 00:20:01,586 --> 00:20:04,612 "Bang bang shoot shoot" [ TV news ]: The town of Virgin, 416 00:20:04,756 --> 00:20:09,489 Utah, has passed a law requiring all residents to own guns. 417 00:20:25,777 --> 00:20:28,075 - Cary McWilliams proudly displays the target 418 00:20:28,213 --> 00:20:30,477 he used to pass his shooting test. 419 00:20:30,615 --> 00:20:32,446 But the thing is, he can't see it. 420 00:20:32,584 --> 00:20:35,576 He's blind. 421 00:20:35,721 --> 00:20:37,586 Cary has had a love affair with guns 422 00:20:37,723 --> 00:20:40,783 since he first got his hands on an M-16 as a teenager. 423 00:20:40,926 --> 00:20:45,090 - I'm actually most comfortable with assault rifles. 424 00:20:45,230 --> 00:20:47,095 - Woo-hoo! 425 00:21:04,616 --> 00:21:06,709 - This is a great place to raise your children. 426 00:21:06,852 --> 00:21:08,843 A really great place to raise your kids. 427 00:21:08,987 --> 00:21:12,445 Very close-knit community we have here. 428 00:21:12,591 --> 00:21:14,855 Everybody looks out for everybody. 429 00:21:14,993 --> 00:21:17,018 - Good people. - Good people. 430 00:21:17,162 --> 00:21:20,962 - This just happens to be a place where two young men 431 00:21:21,099 --> 00:21:23,397 made very bad, very wrong decisions. 432 00:21:23,535 --> 00:21:27,062 And there's been international notoriety as a result of it. 433 00:21:27,205 --> 00:21:28,570 Other than that, 434 00:21:28,707 --> 00:21:30,902 I don't know that Littleton is a lot different 435 00:21:31,042 --> 00:21:34,136 than a whole lot of other suburban communities. 436 00:21:38,283 --> 00:21:40,581 Economic Development P.R. Video 437 00:21:40,652 --> 00:21:42,620 - Good morning, Mr. Edwards, members of the board. 438 00:21:42,687 --> 00:21:45,349 I'd like to report that I've found the perfect location 439 00:21:45,490 --> 00:21:48,357 for our new corporate office, South Metro Denver. 440 00:21:48,493 --> 00:21:50,290 You can see, 441 00:21:50,428 --> 00:21:53,090 I don't need these. Because South Metro Denver 442 00:21:53,231 --> 00:21:56,257 has about the same amount of sunshine and precipitation 443 00:21:56,401 --> 00:21:58,164 as Southern California. It's so incredible, 444 00:21:58,303 --> 00:22:00,828 you're just gonna have to see it for yourselves. 445 00:22:00,972 --> 00:22:03,133 How's this look, Mr. Edwards? 446 00:22:12,884 --> 00:22:15,216 Denny Fennel Home Security Consultant 447 00:22:15,287 --> 00:22:17,755 - We're south of Denver, in a community called Littleton, 448 00:22:17,823 --> 00:22:19,791 and this house is pretty much 449 00:22:19,925 --> 00:22:23,258 your average middle-class suburban home. 450 00:22:23,395 --> 00:22:25,226 The burglar or the rapist is still here 451 00:22:25,363 --> 00:22:26,728 in the neighbourhood somewhere. 452 00:22:26,865 --> 00:22:29,561 And so citizens sometimes think that... 453 00:22:29,701 --> 00:22:31,396 I have people tell me all the time-- 454 00:22:31,536 --> 00:22:35,267 - Where exactly is the burglar or rapist right now? 455 00:22:35,407 --> 00:22:38,001 If I was to try and stab you through this, right here, 456 00:22:38,143 --> 00:22:40,577 you're gonna have to be really close. Right? 457 00:22:40,712 --> 00:22:42,737 - And here's the bottom line on this. 458 00:22:42,881 --> 00:22:44,246 - What if I had a spear? 459 00:22:44,382 --> 00:22:47,840 - Now, downstairs is where the safe-room was constructed, 460 00:22:47,986 --> 00:22:50,921 and this is a solid-core door, a very heavy door. 461 00:22:51,056 --> 00:22:54,082 And now, the criminal has to break through this door, 462 00:22:54,226 --> 00:22:55,750 so you've created another barrier. 463 00:22:55,894 --> 00:22:58,727 - An axe would do it. - An axe would do it. 464 00:22:58,864 --> 00:23:01,424 I think that Columbine did a couple of things. 465 00:23:01,566 --> 00:23:05,764 One is that it changed how we talk. That's the first thing. 466 00:23:05,904 --> 00:23:08,099 - How's that? - Well, for instance, 467 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,367 if I say "Columbine," everybody knows what it means. 468 00:23:10,508 --> 00:23:16,606 I don't have to explain to you that Columbine... 469 00:23:16,748 --> 00:23:19,444 - Is... What's wrong? - Nothing, I just... 470 00:23:19,584 --> 00:23:21,711 - What's wrong? - I-- I just... 471 00:23:21,853 --> 00:23:25,550 sometimes Columbine bothers me. I'll be fine. Just a minute. 472 00:23:25,690 --> 00:23:28,250 - That's okay, that's okay. - Um... 473 00:23:32,364 --> 00:23:35,424 There... there's something, um... 474 00:23:37,369 --> 00:23:43,069 something overwhelming about that kind of... viciousness, 475 00:23:43,208 --> 00:23:50,239 that kind of predatory action, that kind of indiscriminate, uh, 476 00:23:50,382 --> 00:23:52,782 killing. 477 00:23:54,019 --> 00:23:56,852 World's Largest Weapons Maker 478 00:23:57,122 --> 00:23:59,249 - This facility, where we're located right now... 479 00:23:59,391 --> 00:24:01,359 Evan McCollum Lockheed Martin Public Relations 480 00:24:01,559 --> 00:24:03,527 and two other major facilities where our employees work 481 00:24:03,595 --> 00:24:05,927 are either in or very near Littleton. 482 00:24:06,064 --> 00:24:10,091 So we have over 5,000 employees at these facilities, 483 00:24:10,235 --> 00:24:12,601 quite a number of whom live in Littleton, 484 00:24:12,737 --> 00:24:15,467 many of whom have children who attend Columbine High School. 485 00:24:15,607 --> 00:24:18,440 I suppose in one way you could say that what happened 486 00:24:18,576 --> 00:24:20,840 at Columbine High School is a microcosm, uh... 487 00:24:20,979 --> 00:24:24,039 of what happens throughout the world. 488 00:24:24,182 --> 00:24:26,514 - You know the signs that we see around here, 489 00:24:26,651 --> 00:24:28,448 the ones that say: "We Are Columbine," 490 00:24:28,586 --> 00:24:32,147 is that how you, Lockheed Martin, feels, 491 00:24:32,290 --> 00:24:34,053 that you're the biggest employer here in Littleton, 492 00:24:34,192 --> 00:24:36,057 you're the biggest weapons- maker? "We Are Columbine." 493 00:24:36,194 --> 00:24:38,890 - I think we probably embody that spirit, 494 00:24:39,030 --> 00:24:41,055 that, yeah, we're all members of this community 495 00:24:41,199 --> 00:24:43,895 and that it behoves us to help one another and to reach out 496 00:24:44,035 --> 00:24:45,400 to assist one another, yeah. 497 00:24:45,537 --> 00:24:47,562 - He told us that no one in Littleton, 498 00:24:47,706 --> 00:24:49,071 including the executives 499 00:24:49,207 --> 00:24:52,404 at Lockheed, could figure out why the boys at Columbine 500 00:24:52,544 --> 00:24:54,239 had resorted to violence. 501 00:24:54,379 --> 00:24:56,074 - Why would kids do this? 502 00:24:56,214 --> 00:25:00,913 Uh, some of the root of that probably has to do 503 00:25:01,052 --> 00:25:03,919 with their anger about various issues 504 00:25:04,055 --> 00:25:06,421 and we became aware of a program 505 00:25:06,558 --> 00:25:08,355 that provides anger-management training. 506 00:25:08,493 --> 00:25:11,553 And so we made a $100,000 contribution 507 00:25:11,696 --> 00:25:14,563 to the Jefferson County schools to use this training 508 00:25:14,699 --> 00:25:18,601 in the schools. We hope to help both teachers and students 509 00:25:18,737 --> 00:25:23,231 learn alternative ways to deal with anger. 510 00:25:23,375 --> 00:25:25,707 - So you don't think our kids say to themselves: 511 00:25:25,844 --> 00:25:27,402 "Well, gee, Dad goes off 512 00:25:27,545 --> 00:25:29,775 to the factory every day and, you know, 513 00:25:29,914 --> 00:25:33,577 he built missiles." These are weapons of mass destruction. 514 00:25:33,718 --> 00:25:35,709 What's the difference between that mass destruction 515 00:25:35,854 --> 00:25:39,381 and the mass destruction over at Columbine High School? 516 00:25:39,524 --> 00:25:41,355 - I guess I don't see that connection, 517 00:25:41,493 --> 00:25:45,395 that specific connection, because the missiles 518 00:25:45,530 --> 00:25:48,363 that you're talking about were built and designed to defend us 519 00:25:48,500 --> 00:25:51,628 from somebody else who would be aggressors against us. 520 00:25:51,770 --> 00:25:54,000 Societies and countries and governments do things 521 00:25:54,139 --> 00:25:55,902 that annoy one another. 522 00:25:56,041 --> 00:25:59,704 But we have to learn to deal with that annoyance 523 00:25:59,844 --> 00:26:03,143 or that anger or that frustration in appropriate ways. 524 00:26:03,281 --> 00:26:04,942 We don't get irritated with somebody 525 00:26:05,083 --> 00:26:06,948 and just 'cause we're mad at them, uh, 526 00:26:07,085 --> 00:26:10,987 drop a bomb or shoot at them, or fire a missile at them. 527 00:26:13,058 --> 00:26:14,525 [ What a Wonderful World by Louis Armstrong ] 528 00:26:14,726 --> 00:26:19,390 1953: U.S. overthrows Prime Minister Mossadeq of Iran. 529 00:26:20,298 --> 00:26:23,995 U.S. installs Shah as dictator. 530 00:26:24,669 --> 00:26:27,866 1954: U.S. overthrows democratically-elected President Arbenz of Guatemala. 531 00:26:28,006 --> 00:26:29,803 200,000 civilians killed. 532 00:26:30,642 --> 00:26:35,170 1963: U.S. backs assassination of South Vietnamese President Diem. 533 00:26:36,448 --> 00:26:40,646 1963-1975: American military kills 4 million people in Southeast Asia. 534 00:26:41,319 --> 00:26:44,152 September 11, 1973: U.S. stages coup in Chile. 535 00:26:44,289 --> 00:26:47,156 Democratically-elected President Salvator Allende assassinated. 536 00:26:47,492 --> 00:26:50,427 Dictator Augusto Pinochet installed. 537 00:26:50,795 --> 00:26:53,195 5,000 Chileans murdered. 538 00:26:53,698 --> 00:26:56,929 1977: U.S. backs military rulers of El Salvador. 539 00:26:57,569 --> 00:27:02,029 70,000 Salvadorans and four American nuns killed. 540 00:27:03,975 --> 00:27:08,537 1980's: U.S. trains Osama bin Laden and fellow terrorists to kill Soviets. 541 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:12,116 CIA gives them $3 billion. 542 00:27:12,250 --> 00:27:18,280 1981: Reagan administration trains and funds "contras". 30,000 Nicaraguans die. 543 00:27:20,125 --> 00:27:24,926 1982: U.S. provides billions in aid to Saddam Hussein for weapons to kill Iranians. 544 00:27:26,064 --> 00:27:30,023 1987: White House secretly gives Iran weapons to kill Iraqis. 545 00:27:31,836 --> 00:27:36,637 1989: CIA agent Manuel Noriega (also serving as President of Panama) disobeys orders from Washington. 546 00:27:38,176 --> 00:27:42,340 U.S. invades Panama and removes Noriega. 547 00:27:43,515 --> 00:27:47,042 3,000 Panamanian civilian casualties. 548 00:27:47,552 --> 00:27:51,386 1990: Iraq invades Kuwait with weapons from U.S. 549 00:27:51,523 --> 00:27:54,253 1991: U.S. enters Iraq. 550 00:27:54,392 --> 00:27:57,225 Bush reinstates dictator of Kuwait. 551 00:27:57,629 --> 00:28:01,759 1998: Clinton bombs "weapons factory" in Sudan. 552 00:28:02,901 --> 00:28:05,665 Factory turns out to be making aspirin. 553 00:28:06,070 --> 00:28:09,904 1991 to present: American planes bomb Iraq on a weekly basis. 554 00:28:10,041 --> 00:28:15,411 U.N. estimates 500,000 Iraqi children die from bombing and sanctions. 555 00:28:15,947 --> 00:28:21,943 2000-01: U.S. gives Taliban-ruled Afghanistan $245 million in "aid." 556 00:28:22,820 --> 00:28:29,123 Sept.11, 2001: Osama bin Laden uses his expert CIA training to murder 3,000 people. 557 00:28:29,494 --> 00:28:31,462 [ end of What a Wonderful World ] 558 00:28:31,829 --> 00:28:35,856 [ screaming ]: Oh my goodness! Oh my word! 559 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,525 Oh my word! 560 00:28:41,839 --> 00:28:44,899 - South of Denver in Littleton, on the grounds 561 00:28:45,043 --> 00:28:46,533 of the U.S. Air Force Academy, 562 00:28:46,678 --> 00:28:48,407 there sits an actual B-52 bomber. 563 00:28:48,546 --> 00:28:51,538 The plaque underneath it proudly proclaims 564 00:28:51,683 --> 00:28:54,174 that this plane killed Vietnamese people 565 00:28:54,319 --> 00:28:57,015 on Christmas eve, 1972. 566 00:28:57,155 --> 00:29:01,785 It was the largest bombing campaign of the Vietnam War. 567 00:29:01,926 --> 00:29:03,757 Just outside Denver is Rocky Flats 568 00:29:03,895 --> 00:29:05,658 the largest plutonium- weapons-making factory 569 00:29:05,797 --> 00:29:07,162 in the world, 570 00:29:07,298 --> 00:29:10,756 and now a massive radioactive dump. 571 00:29:10,902 --> 00:29:12,961 A few miles away, buried inside a mountain, 572 00:29:13,104 --> 00:29:16,232 is NORAD, which oversees our nuclear missiles, 573 00:29:16,374 --> 00:29:18,001 many of which dot 574 00:29:18,142 --> 00:29:19,769 the Colorado landscape. 575 00:29:23,147 --> 00:29:27,413 And once a month, Lockheed transports one of its rockets, 576 00:29:27,552 --> 00:29:28,917 with its Pentagon payload, 577 00:29:29,053 --> 00:29:30,577 through the streets of Littleton, 578 00:29:30,722 --> 00:29:32,917 passing nearby Columbine High School 579 00:29:33,057 --> 00:29:35,025 on its way to an air-force base 580 00:29:35,159 --> 00:29:37,252 on the other side of Denver. 581 00:29:37,395 --> 00:29:40,091 The rockets are transported in the middle of the night, 582 00:29:40,231 --> 00:29:45,669 while the children of Columbine are asleep. 583 00:29:47,572 --> 00:29:49,540 [ gunfire ] 584 00:29:54,312 --> 00:29:57,907 Largest one day bombing by U.S. in Kosovo war 585 00:29:58,082 --> 00:30:00,050 - Twenty-two NATO missiles 586 00:30:00,184 --> 00:30:02,709 fell on the village of Bogutovac near Kraljevo. 587 00:30:02,854 --> 00:30:06,346 Deadly cargo was dropped upon the residential part 588 00:30:06,491 --> 00:30:07,719 of the village. 589 00:30:07,859 --> 00:30:10,885 - We're striking hard at Serbia's machinery of repression, 590 00:30:11,029 --> 00:30:12,792 while making a deliberate effort 591 00:30:12,930 --> 00:30:15,398 to minimize harm to innocent people. 592 00:30:15,533 --> 00:30:19,629 - On the hit list were a local hospital and primary school. 593 00:30:21,272 --> 00:30:23,740 - We all know there has been a terrible shooting 594 00:30:23,875 --> 00:30:26,810 at a high school in Littleton, Colorado. 595 00:30:26,944 --> 00:30:30,471 I hope the American people will be praying for the students, 596 00:30:30,615 --> 00:30:32,412 the parents and the teachers. 597 00:30:32,550 --> 00:30:35,041 And we'll wait for events to unfold 598 00:30:35,186 --> 00:30:37,347 and then there'll be more to say. 599 00:30:39,123 --> 00:30:40,454 - Jefferson County, 911. 600 00:30:40,692 --> 00:30:42,159 - There's some boy at Columbine High School, someone killed... 601 00:30:42,393 --> 00:30:44,088 - Do you know if anybody's injured? 602 00:30:44,195 --> 00:30:45,719 - Yes. - They've got pipe bombs, 603 00:30:45,830 --> 00:30:47,422 pipe bombs... 604 00:30:47,565 --> 00:30:49,192 - You're shitting me. - I'm not. 605 00:30:49,334 --> 00:30:51,268 - Student hit in the spine at Columbine. 606 00:30:51,402 --> 00:30:53,097 - Okay. - We've got... 607 00:30:53,237 --> 00:30:55,171 - He's shot in the head. - He's shot in the head? 608 00:30:55,306 --> 00:30:57,433 - Deputy cashier's office. - We have automatic weapons, 609 00:30:57,575 --> 00:30:58,940 okay? - Yes. 610 00:30:59,077 --> 00:31:01,602 - All right. Can you get us lots and lots of paramedics? 611 00:31:01,746 --> 00:31:05,443 - So he's still under an attack? - Yes, sir, the school is. 612 00:31:05,583 --> 00:31:08,108 - We got a couple of kids out in the hall that are shot, 613 00:31:08,252 --> 00:31:11,119 so they're trying to get to them. Do not let anybody else in 614 00:31:11,255 --> 00:31:14,053 until we tell them. - Jefferson County 911. 615 00:31:14,192 --> 00:31:15,784 - Hi, it's Izzy Povich at NBC News. 616 00:31:15,927 --> 00:31:17,758 We're calling about the school shooting. 617 00:31:17,895 --> 00:31:20,455 We're on the air live right now on MSNBC. 618 00:31:20,598 --> 00:31:23,066 Can you-- Is that something you could just, literally, 619 00:31:23,201 --> 00:31:25,328 patch through to my desk, 620 00:31:25,470 --> 00:31:27,904 or you could tell us on the air? I could put you through 621 00:31:28,039 --> 00:31:29,404 right now-- - I understand that... 622 00:31:29,540 --> 00:31:31,405 - Now they said he's gone to the library; 623 00:31:31,542 --> 00:31:32,907 he stayed in the building. 624 00:31:33,044 --> 00:31:35,239 He's gone into the library and he's in the building. 625 00:31:35,380 --> 00:31:37,405 - Hi, this is Stephanie Gold from Dateline. How you doing? 626 00:31:37,548 --> 00:31:39,072 - Good, how are you? - Fine, thanks. 627 00:31:39,217 --> 00:31:41,742 - I love your show. - Oh, I'm so glad. Thank you. 628 00:31:41,886 --> 00:31:44,377 - I watch it every night. - Thank you. 629 00:31:44,522 --> 00:31:47,252 - Jefferson County 911. - Yes, I'm a teacher 630 00:31:47,392 --> 00:31:50,691 at Columbine High School. There is a shooter here with a gun. 631 00:31:50,828 --> 00:31:53,422 He just shot out a window. - Has anybody been injured? 632 00:31:53,564 --> 00:31:56,931 - Yes! And the school is in a panic 633 00:31:57,068 --> 00:32:00,435 and I'm in the library. I've got students down. 634 00:32:00,571 --> 00:32:02,266 Under the tables, kids! 635 00:32:02,407 --> 00:32:04,773 Heads under the tables! I saw a student outside! 636 00:32:04,909 --> 00:32:07,002 Okay, 637 00:32:07,145 --> 00:32:09,943 I was on hall duty, I saw a gun! "What's going on out there?!" 638 00:32:10,081 --> 00:32:12,777 He turned the gun straight at us and he shot, and my God, 639 00:32:12,917 --> 00:32:14,282 the window went out. 640 00:32:14,419 --> 00:32:17,013 The kid standing there with me, I think he got hit. 641 00:32:17,155 --> 00:32:18,520 - We've got help on the way, ma'am. 642 00:32:18,656 --> 00:32:20,351 - Oh God! - Stay on line with me. 643 00:32:20,491 --> 00:32:24,086 - Oh God! [ gunfire ] 644 00:32:24,228 --> 00:32:26,526 - I think he's shooting in the library right now. 645 00:32:26,664 --> 00:32:29,360 He's firing shots from the library. 646 00:32:29,500 --> 00:32:31,127 - Firing shots in the library. - ...our way. 647 00:32:31,269 --> 00:32:33,965 Do we need to leave? Okay, hold on. 648 00:32:34,105 --> 00:32:36,198 - ...inside the cafeteria 649 00:32:36,340 --> 00:32:39,104 I'm gonna have to try and get outta here and call you back. 650 00:32:39,243 --> 00:32:41,541 - I called in before, trying to find out 651 00:32:41,679 --> 00:32:44,045 where I'm supposed to go and they put me on hold 652 00:32:44,182 --> 00:32:47,049 for freaking ever! - Hi, it's Wendy at CNN still. 653 00:32:47,185 --> 00:32:50,120 - Hi. We're just taking names and numbers for the press. 654 00:32:50,254 --> 00:32:53,712 - Fox has somebody from your office on now-- 655 00:32:53,858 --> 00:32:55,382 - We've talked to a bunch of people 656 00:32:55,526 --> 00:32:56,993 and we can only do so many, 657 00:32:57,128 --> 00:32:59,062 we got so many more calls coming in. 658 00:32:59,197 --> 00:33:01,028 - I gotta get to my daughter at Columbine. 659 00:33:01,165 --> 00:33:03,998 I've been trying for an hour, I can't get anywhere near there... 660 00:33:04,135 --> 00:33:05,727 - Sir, okay, calm down, okay? 661 00:33:05,870 --> 00:33:08,065 - I think we're entitled to information as parents 662 00:33:08,206 --> 00:33:11,175 on where our children are! - We have a lot of units 663 00:33:11,309 --> 00:33:13,436 out there right now. - I can't get anywhere near it. 664 00:33:13,578 --> 00:33:14,408 I wanna find out 665 00:33:14,545 --> 00:33:16,445 how to get in touch with my daughter. 666 00:33:16,581 --> 00:33:19,311 How do I get information on my daughter? 667 00:33:19,450 --> 00:33:20,974 - I don't have that information right now-- 668 00:33:21,118 --> 00:33:23,245 - Why in the hell not? It's been over an hour! 669 00:33:23,387 --> 00:33:24,752 - My son is Eric Harris, 670 00:33:24,889 --> 00:33:26,914 and I'm afraid that he might be involved 671 00:33:27,058 --> 00:33:28,719 with the shooting at Columbine High School. 672 00:33:28,860 --> 00:33:30,760 - Involved how? 673 00:33:30,895 --> 00:33:33,921 - He's a member of what they're calling the "trench-coat mafia." 674 00:33:34,065 --> 00:33:36,260 - Have you spoken to your son? - No, I haven't. 675 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,561 Have they picked up anybody yet? - They're still looking 676 00:33:38,703 --> 00:33:42,195 for suspects. Your son is with who? What gang? 677 00:33:42,340 --> 00:33:45,537 - They call them the "trench-coat mafia". I just heard that term 678 00:33:45,676 --> 00:33:47,576 on TV. - Stay low, because if you try 679 00:33:47,712 --> 00:33:49,737 to leave, I don't want you to get shot. 680 00:33:49,881 --> 00:33:51,280 Stay very low and quiet. 681 00:33:51,415 --> 00:33:53,110 Low and quiet... 682 00:33:57,021 --> 00:34:00,047 - Everybody just stay quiet. 683 00:34:13,037 --> 00:34:16,438 - When the shooting was over, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold 684 00:34:16,574 --> 00:34:20,601 had killed 12 students and one teacher. 685 00:34:20,745 --> 00:34:24,306 Dozens of others were wounded by the over-900 rounds of ammo 686 00:34:24,448 --> 00:34:26,973 that were fired. It is believed that the guns that they used 687 00:34:27,118 --> 00:34:30,554 were all legally purchased at stores and gun shows. 688 00:34:30,688 --> 00:34:32,747 And many of the bullets were bought 689 00:34:32,890 --> 00:34:36,257 at the Littleton K-Mart just down the street. 690 00:34:36,394 --> 00:34:38,794 - Harris's diary also detailed ideas about hijacking 691 00:34:38,930 --> 00:34:41,558 an airplane and crashing it into New York City. 692 00:34:41,699 --> 00:34:44,099 Some may characterize that as fantasy... 693 00:34:44,235 --> 00:34:49,605 - In the end, they turned the guns on themselves. 694 00:34:49,740 --> 00:34:51,970 - And then he came into the library, 695 00:34:52,109 --> 00:34:55,601 shot everybody around me, then put a gun to my head 696 00:34:55,746 --> 00:34:58,647 and asked if we all wanted to die and... 697 00:34:58,783 --> 00:35:00,808 - We started hearing shots in the hall 698 00:35:00,952 --> 00:35:03,352 and then they came in and they all told us 699 00:35:03,487 --> 00:35:06,012 to get under the desk and we all got under the desk 700 00:35:06,157 --> 00:35:10,150 and then they started coming in the library and opening fire... 701 00:35:10,294 --> 00:35:12,819 - I just started screaming and crying and telling them 702 00:35:12,964 --> 00:35:16,229 not to shoot me. And so he shot the girl, 703 00:35:16,367 --> 00:35:19,097 he shot her in the head in front of me. 704 00:35:19,236 --> 00:35:23,502 Then he shot the black kid, because he was black. 705 00:35:26,243 --> 00:35:28,507 - I have only five words for you: 706 00:35:28,613 --> 00:35:31,207 From my cold, dead hands. 707 00:35:31,349 --> 00:35:34,011 [ cheering ] 708 00:35:34,151 --> 00:35:35,812 - Just 10 days after the Columbine killings, 709 00:35:35,953 --> 00:35:37,352 despite the pleas 710 00:35:37,488 --> 00:35:40,013 of a community in mourning, 711 00:35:40,157 --> 00:35:43,320 Charlton Heston came to Denver and held a large pro-gun rally 712 00:35:43,461 --> 00:35:45,361 for the National Rifle Association. 713 00:35:45,496 --> 00:35:48,829 - Good morning. [ crowd ]: Good morning. 714 00:35:48,966 --> 00:35:50,331 Thank you all 715 00:35:50,468 --> 00:35:55,064 for coming and thank you for supporting your organization. 716 00:35:55,206 --> 00:35:58,835 I also want to applaud your courage in coming here today. 717 00:35:58,976 --> 00:36:03,345 I have a message from the mayor, 718 00:36:03,481 --> 00:36:05,176 Mr. Wellington Webb, the mayor of Denver. 719 00:36:05,316 --> 00:36:06,681 [ booing ] 720 00:36:06,817 --> 00:36:09,581 - No, no, no, no, no. 721 00:36:09,720 --> 00:36:12,746 He sent me this, 722 00:36:12,890 --> 00:36:16,849 and it says: "Don't come here. We don't want you here." 723 00:36:16,994 --> 00:36:20,930 I said to the mayor, "This is our country. 724 00:36:21,065 --> 00:36:24,660 As Americans we're free to travel wherever we want 725 00:36:24,802 --> 00:36:27,771 in our broad land." [ applause ] 726 00:36:36,013 --> 00:36:39,881 Don't come here? We're already here. 727 00:36:40,017 --> 00:36:41,746 [ cheering ] 728 00:36:46,991 --> 00:36:49,459 - I am here today... 729 00:36:49,593 --> 00:36:53,085 because my son Daniel would want me to be here today. 730 00:37:03,941 --> 00:37:07,570 If my son Daniel was not one of the victims, 731 00:37:07,712 --> 00:37:10,476 he would be here with me today. 732 00:37:15,086 --> 00:37:18,920 Something is wrong in this country... 733 00:37:19,056 --> 00:37:21,581 when a child... 734 00:37:21,726 --> 00:37:26,186 can grab a gun... grab a gun so easily... 735 00:37:26,330 --> 00:37:28,730 and shoot a bullet... 736 00:37:31,836 --> 00:37:36,899 into the middle of a child's face, as my son experienced. 737 00:37:38,509 --> 00:37:39,908 Something is wrong. 738 00:37:40,044 --> 00:37:44,913 But the time has come to come to understand 739 00:37:45,049 --> 00:37:49,383 that a Tech-9 semi-automatic 30-bullet weapon 740 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,114 like that that killed my son, 741 00:37:52,256 --> 00:37:54,383 is not used to kill deer. 742 00:37:54,525 --> 00:37:58,120 It has no useful purpose. 743 00:37:58,262 --> 00:38:01,595 It is time to address this problem. 744 00:38:04,835 --> 00:38:07,395 - We have work to do, hearts to heal, 745 00:38:07,538 --> 00:38:10,632 evil to defeat and a country to unite. 746 00:38:10,775 --> 00:38:12,743 We may have differences, yes, 747 00:38:12,877 --> 00:38:16,904 and we will again suffer tragedy almost beyond description. 748 00:38:17,047 --> 00:38:19,675 But when the sun sets on Denver tonight, 749 00:38:19,817 --> 00:38:25,016 and forever more, let it always set on we the people, 750 00:38:25,156 --> 00:38:29,855 secure in our land of the free and home of the brave. 751 00:38:29,994 --> 00:38:33,361 I, for one, plan to do my part. 752 00:38:33,497 --> 00:38:35,021 Thank you. 753 00:38:35,166 --> 00:38:37,896 [ cheering and clapping ] 754 00:38:38,035 --> 00:38:39,696 - Or like when they had their convention in Colorado, 755 00:38:42,506 --> 00:38:43,837 a week, whatever, the month after Columbine, 756 00:38:43,941 --> 00:38:45,203 that was just stupid. Just don't do that. 757 00:38:45,342 --> 00:38:47,970 Of course you have "the right to," but what are you doing? 758 00:38:48,112 --> 00:38:50,876 Upsetting a whole city full of people, why would you do that? 759 00:38:51,015 --> 00:38:54,212 - This is Matt Stone. He grew up in Littleton 760 00:38:54,351 --> 00:38:56,546 and has fond memories of Columbine. 761 00:38:56,687 --> 00:38:59,053 - Yeah, Columbine, it's just a crappy school 762 00:38:59,190 --> 00:39:01,215 in the middle of a bunch of crappy houses. 763 00:39:01,358 --> 00:39:03,326 - Matt and his friend Trey Parker 764 00:39:03,460 --> 00:39:05,087 found a way to take out 765 00:39:05,229 --> 00:39:08,164 their anger of being different in Littleton 766 00:39:08,299 --> 00:39:14,135 and turn it not into carnage, but into a cartoon. 767 00:39:14,271 --> 00:39:19,538 "Just another Sunday morning In my quiet... 768 00:39:19,677 --> 00:39:21,804 "Mountain town" 769 00:39:21,946 --> 00:39:24,312 [ music ] 770 00:39:24,448 --> 00:39:27,246 "You can see your breath Hanging in the air 771 00:39:27,384 --> 00:39:29,511 "You see homeless people But you just don't care 772 00:39:29,653 --> 00:39:33,020 "It's a sea of smiles In which we'd be glad to drown 773 00:39:33,157 --> 00:39:35,648 "It's Sunday morning In our quiet little 774 00:39:35,793 --> 00:39:37,954 "White-bread redneck mountain town" 775 00:39:38,095 --> 00:39:40,029 - Columbine is a normal high school-- 776 00:39:40,164 --> 00:39:41,756 - Yeah. - ...in a normal suburb-- 777 00:39:41,899 --> 00:39:43,264 - Yeah. - ...you know, basically. 778 00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,095 - Yeah. Painfully, painfully, painfully normal. 779 00:39:45,236 --> 00:39:48,262 Just absolutely, painfully, horribly average. 780 00:39:48,405 --> 00:39:51,135 Littleton in general is... 781 00:39:51,275 --> 00:39:54,608 I remember being in sixth grade and I... 782 00:39:54,745 --> 00:39:57,111 had to take the math test to get into Honors Math 783 00:39:57,248 --> 00:39:59,113 in the seventh grade. And they're, like, 784 00:39:59,250 --> 00:40:01,445 "Don't screw this up. Because if you screw this up, 785 00:40:01,585 --> 00:40:03,610 you won't get into Honors Math in seventh grade. 786 00:40:03,754 --> 00:40:05,779 And if you don't get in in seventh grade, 787 00:40:05,923 --> 00:40:08,118 you won't in eighth grade, then not in ninth grade. 788 00:40:08,259 --> 00:40:10,454 And 10th and 11th grade and you'll just die poor 789 00:40:10,594 --> 00:40:12,061 and lonely." And that's it, you know? 790 00:40:12,196 --> 00:40:17,133 You believe, in high school - and a lot of it is kids, 791 00:40:17,268 --> 00:40:19,463 but the teachers and counsellors and principals 792 00:40:19,603 --> 00:40:24,063 don't help things. They scare you into conforming 793 00:40:24,208 --> 00:40:27,075 and doing good in school by saying: "If you're a loser now, 794 00:40:27,211 --> 00:40:28,906 you're gonna be a loser forever." 795 00:40:29,046 --> 00:40:31,241 So that with Eric and Dylan, people called them "fag." 796 00:40:31,382 --> 00:40:32,747 They're like, "You know what? 797 00:40:32,883 --> 00:40:34,908 If I'm a fag, now I'm a fag forever." 798 00:40:35,052 --> 00:40:37,543 And you wish someone just could've grabbed them and gone, 799 00:40:37,688 --> 00:40:39,918 "Dude, high school's not the end of... 800 00:40:40,057 --> 00:40:42,617 A year, a year and a half, was it? I don't even know. 801 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,593 You just move out-- - No, no, they were two weeks 802 00:40:45,729 --> 00:40:48,755 away from graduation. - Yeah, you're done. 803 00:40:48,899 --> 00:40:51,265 It's amazing how fast you lose touch with all those people. 804 00:40:51,402 --> 00:40:54,269 They just beat it in your head as early as sixth grade: 805 00:40:54,405 --> 00:40:56,100 "Don't fuck up. 'Cause if you do, 806 00:40:56,240 --> 00:40:57,764 you're gonna die poor and lonely. 807 00:40:57,908 --> 00:40:59,933 You don't want to do that." You're, like, "Fuck, 808 00:41:00,077 --> 00:41:02,102 whatever I am now, I'm that forever." Of course, 809 00:41:02,246 --> 00:41:04,441 it's completely opposite. All the dorks in high school 810 00:41:04,581 --> 00:41:06,947 go on to do great things and all the really cool guys 811 00:41:07,084 --> 00:41:10,110 are all living back in Littleton as insurance agents. 812 00:41:10,254 --> 00:41:13,121 Almost person to person, it's completely that way. 813 00:41:13,257 --> 00:41:15,418 If somebody could've told them that, 814 00:41:15,559 --> 00:41:17,857 maybe they would've have done it, but... 815 00:41:17,995 --> 00:41:19,963 - I guess we'll never know why they did it, 816 00:41:20,097 --> 00:41:22,031 but one thing adults should never forget: 817 00:41:22,166 --> 00:41:24,726 It still sucks being a teenager. 818 00:41:24,868 --> 00:41:27,029 And it really sucks going to school. 819 00:41:27,171 --> 00:41:28,570 - What's your view on high school? 820 00:41:28,706 --> 00:41:30,071 - Uh, I love it. 821 00:41:30,207 --> 00:41:32,175 Columbine Student Video 822 00:41:32,376 --> 00:41:34,901 Uh, I learn, I get picked on by bastards who hate me, 823 00:41:35,045 --> 00:41:37,673 and the principal's a dick. 824 00:41:37,815 --> 00:41:39,942 - All right. What causes school violence? 825 00:41:40,084 --> 00:41:42,075 - Uh... him. 826 00:41:42,219 --> 00:41:45,382 - Him? - Yeah. 827 00:41:45,522 --> 00:41:48,423 - Yes, and after Columbine, it really sucked 828 00:41:48,559 --> 00:41:50,083 being a student in America. 829 00:41:50,227 --> 00:41:52,354 [ TV news ]: Since last spring's shooting, 830 00:41:52,496 --> 00:41:54,760 at Columbine High, schools nationwide 831 00:41:54,898 --> 00:41:56,866 have extended zero-tolerance policies, 832 00:41:57,001 --> 00:41:59,595 suspending and expelling students for all kinds 833 00:41:59,737 --> 00:42:02,433 of behaviour considered unruly, 834 00:42:02,573 --> 00:42:05,098 or warning signs of violence to come. 835 00:42:05,242 --> 00:42:07,938 This second-grader in Illinois was suspended for 10 days 836 00:42:08,078 --> 00:42:09,773 for bringing a nail clipper to class 837 00:42:09,913 --> 00:42:11,608 "That's a weapon," his school said. 838 00:42:11,749 --> 00:42:13,842 - An elementary school suspended a first-grader 839 00:42:13,984 --> 00:42:16,282 for pointing a chicken strip at a teacher in the cafeteria. 840 00:42:16,420 --> 00:42:19,014 The eight-year-old was fooling around with a friend 841 00:42:19,156 --> 00:42:22,057 at lunch last week when he pointed a breaded-chicken finger 842 00:42:22,192 --> 00:42:24,285 at a teacher and then said: "Pow pow. 843 00:42:24,428 --> 00:42:26,623 - He pointed a folded piece of paper shaped like a gun, 844 00:42:26,764 --> 00:42:28,959 and told his classmates he was going to kill them 845 00:42:29,099 --> 00:42:31,294 during a game of cops and robbers. 846 00:42:31,435 --> 00:42:34,302 - If this isn't a warning sign, then what is it? 847 00:42:34,438 --> 00:42:36,565 - This Virginia high-school student spent a month 848 00:42:36,707 --> 00:42:38,197 out of classes, originally sent home 849 00:42:38,342 --> 00:42:41,038 for dying his hair blue. - A high-school honour student 850 00:42:41,178 --> 00:42:43,237 from Michigan could be expelled later today 851 00:42:43,380 --> 00:42:44,813 in a school-board hearing. 852 00:42:44,948 --> 00:42:47,416 Seventeen-year-old Jeremy Hicks wore a Scottish 853 00:42:47,551 --> 00:42:51,214 bagpiper's outfit to his junior prom that included 854 00:42:51,355 --> 00:42:54,756 a plaid kilt, a feathered hat and a traditional knife 855 00:42:54,892 --> 00:42:56,655 known as a "skein dhu." 856 00:42:56,794 --> 00:42:58,318 - This T-shirt 857 00:42:58,462 --> 00:42:59,929 landed a high-school student in court. 858 00:43:00,064 --> 00:43:02,157 She wanted to start an anarchy club. 859 00:43:02,299 --> 00:43:04,426 - The little time-bombs that are out there ticking, 860 00:43:04,568 --> 00:43:07,435 waiting to go off. And there are many of them in every community. 861 00:43:07,571 --> 00:43:09,937 - Students in at least seven different states 862 00:43:10,074 --> 00:43:11,632 have been suspended or arrested 863 00:43:11,775 --> 00:43:15,176 for talking about or planning plots of their own. 864 00:43:15,312 --> 00:43:16,939 - It's almost like guerrilla warfare. 865 00:43:17,081 --> 00:43:19,049 You don't know from which direction 866 00:43:19,149 --> 00:43:20,480 the enemy will be coming. 867 00:43:23,287 --> 00:43:24,618 Marketing video from Garrett Metal Detectors 868 00:43:24,721 --> 00:43:25,949 - Having a well-conceived and strictly enforced dress code 869 00:43:26,023 --> 00:43:27,422 can dramatically improve the safety of a school, 870 00:43:27,558 --> 00:43:29,617 and can ensure a positive learning environment 871 00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:31,125 for everyone. 872 00:43:31,261 --> 00:43:33,525 As this student's appearance demonstrates, 873 00:43:33,664 --> 00:43:36,724 having a lax policy about dress makes it easy 874 00:43:36,867 --> 00:43:38,698 for a student to conceal a weapon 875 00:43:38,836 --> 00:43:42,602 and makes it difficult to identify intruders on campus. 876 00:43:42,739 --> 00:43:45,401 A dress code can reduce weapons violations, 877 00:43:45,542 --> 00:43:50,002 relieve tensions between gangs, reduce disciplinary infractions 878 00:43:50,147 --> 00:43:52,945 and generally improve the atmosphere of the school. 879 00:43:53,083 --> 00:43:56,314 Our policy requires that students tuck in their shirts, 880 00:43:56,453 --> 00:43:59,217 making the beltline visible at all times. 881 00:43:59,356 --> 00:44:01,586 Our students may not wear baggy pants 882 00:44:01,725 --> 00:44:04,751 or colours or insignias that are commonly associated 883 00:44:04,895 --> 00:44:06,590 with gang activity. 884 00:44:06,730 --> 00:44:09,528 This policy was a collaborative effort. 885 00:44:09,666 --> 00:44:13,124 - Yes, our children were indeed something to fear. 886 00:44:15,339 --> 00:44:18,502 They had turned into little monsters. 887 00:44:18,642 --> 00:44:20,837 But who was to blame? 888 00:44:20,978 --> 00:44:22,411 All the experts had an answer. 889 00:44:22,546 --> 00:44:26,073 - Angry, heavy-metal subculture. 890 00:44:26,216 --> 00:44:28,582 - Where were the parents? - Violent movies. 891 00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,984 - "South Park." - Video games. - Television. - Entertainment. 892 00:44:32,122 --> 00:44:34,716 - Satan. - Cartoons. - Films. - Society. - Toy guns. 893 00:44:34,858 --> 00:44:37,759 - Drugs. - Shock-rocker Marilyn Manson. 894 00:44:37,895 --> 00:44:40,830 [ all ]: Marilyn Manson. 895 00:44:40,964 --> 00:44:43,558 - Marilyn Manson has cancelled the last five dates 896 00:44:43,700 --> 00:44:47,067 of his U.S, tour out of respect for those lost in Littleton. 897 00:44:47,204 --> 00:44:49,604 But the singer says artists like himself 898 00:44:49,740 --> 00:44:51,605 are not the ones to blame. 899 00:44:53,677 --> 00:44:55,440 - This is perhaps the sickest group ever promoted 900 00:44:55,546 --> 00:44:58,276 by a mainstream record company. 901 00:44:58,415 --> 00:45:00,508 "I'm not a slave 902 00:45:00,651 --> 00:45:02,175 "to a god 903 00:45:02,319 --> 00:45:05,015 "that doesn't exist" 904 00:45:05,155 --> 00:45:06,918 - After Columbine, it seemed 905 00:45:07,057 --> 00:45:09,491 that the entire focus on why the shootings occurred 906 00:45:09,626 --> 00:45:10,888 was because the killers 907 00:45:11,028 --> 00:45:13,258 listened to Marilyn Manson. 908 00:45:13,397 --> 00:45:15,262 Two years after Columbine, 909 00:45:15,399 --> 00:45:17,594 Manson finally returned to Denver. 910 00:45:17,734 --> 00:45:19,565 - The Oz Fest at Mile High Stadium 911 00:45:19,703 --> 00:45:21,898 brings shock-rocker Marilyn Manson to Denver tomorrow. 912 00:45:22,039 --> 00:45:25,304 - There were protests from the religious right. 913 00:45:25,442 --> 00:45:27,535 But I thought I'd go and talk with him myself. 914 00:45:27,678 --> 00:45:30,078 - When I was a kid growing up, music was the escape. 915 00:45:30,214 --> 00:45:32,079 That's the only thing 916 00:45:32,216 --> 00:45:36,050 that had no judgements. You can put on a record 917 00:45:36,186 --> 00:45:39,485 and it's not gonna yell at you for dressing the way you do. 918 00:45:39,623 --> 00:45:41,818 It's gonna make you feel better about it. 919 00:45:41,959 --> 00:45:45,156 - Some will be so brash to ask if we believe 920 00:45:45,295 --> 00:45:47,490 that all who hear Manson tomorrow night 921 00:45:47,631 --> 00:45:49,861 will go out and commit violent acts. 922 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,992 The answer is "no." But does everybody 923 00:45:53,136 --> 00:45:56,071 who watches a Lexus ad go and buy a Lexus? 924 00:45:56,206 --> 00:45:58,333 No. But a few do. 925 00:45:58,475 --> 00:46:01,774 - I definitely can see why they would pick me, 926 00:46:01,912 --> 00:46:05,313 because I think it's easy to throw my face on a TV, 927 00:46:05,449 --> 00:46:09,977 because I'm, in the end, sort of a poster boy for fear. 928 00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:13,453 Because I represent what everyone's afraid of, 929 00:46:13,590 --> 00:46:15,854 because I do and say what I want. 930 00:46:15,993 --> 00:46:19,087 - If Marilyn Manson can walk into our town and promote hate, 931 00:46:19,229 --> 00:46:22,096 violence, suicide, death, drug use 932 00:46:22,232 --> 00:46:24,029 and Columbine-like behaviour, 933 00:46:24,167 --> 00:46:27,364 I can say, "Not without a fight, you can't." 934 00:46:27,504 --> 00:46:32,999 - The two by-products of that whole tragedy were, uh... 935 00:46:33,143 --> 00:46:35,611 violence in entertainment and gun control. 936 00:46:35,746 --> 00:46:38,874 And how perfect that that was the two things 937 00:46:39,016 --> 00:46:41,041 that we were gonna talk about with the upcoming election. 938 00:46:41,184 --> 00:46:43,550 And also, then we forgot about Monica Lewinsky 939 00:46:43,687 --> 00:46:45,552 and we forgot about... 940 00:46:45,689 --> 00:46:48,055 The president was shooting bombs overseas, 941 00:46:48,191 --> 00:46:54,061 yet I'm a bad guy because I sing some rock'n'roll songs. 942 00:46:54,197 --> 00:46:57,064 And who's a bigger influence, the president or Marilyn Manson? 943 00:46:57,200 --> 00:46:59,828 I'd like to think me, but I'm gonna go with the president. 944 00:46:59,970 --> 00:47:02,063 - Do you know the day that Columbine happened, 945 00:47:02,205 --> 00:47:04,571 the United States dropped more bombs on Kosovo 946 00:47:04,708 --> 00:47:06,573 than any other time during that war? 947 00:47:06,710 --> 00:47:09,008 - I do know that and I think that's really ironic, 948 00:47:09,146 --> 00:47:13,082 that nobody said, "Well, maybe the president had an influence 949 00:47:13,216 --> 00:47:15,081 on this violent behaviour. 950 00:47:15,218 --> 00:47:17,413 Because that's not the way the media wants to take it 951 00:47:17,554 --> 00:47:19,545 and spin it and turn it into fear. 952 00:47:19,690 --> 00:47:21,555 'Cause then you're watching television, 953 00:47:21,692 --> 00:47:24,525 you're watching the news; you're being pumped full of fear. 954 00:47:24,661 --> 00:47:27,221 And there's floods, there's AIDS, there's murder. 955 00:47:27,364 --> 00:47:31,027 You cut to commercial, buy the Acura, buy the Colgate. 956 00:47:31,168 --> 00:47:33,534 If you have bad breath, they're not gonna talk to you. 957 00:47:33,670 --> 00:47:36,366 If you got pimples, the girl's not gonna fuck you. 958 00:47:36,506 --> 00:47:40,909 It's a campaign of fear and consumption. 959 00:47:41,044 --> 00:47:43,035 And that's what I think that's it's all based on, 960 00:47:43,180 --> 00:47:45,842 is the whole idea that: keep everyone afraid, 961 00:47:45,982 --> 00:47:49,383 and they'll consume. And that's really as simple 962 00:47:49,519 --> 00:47:51,749 as it can be boiled down to. - Right. 963 00:47:51,888 --> 00:47:54,049 If you were to talk directly to the kids at Columbine 964 00:47:54,191 --> 00:47:56,056 and the people in that community, 965 00:47:56,193 --> 00:47:58,559 what would you say to them, if they here right now? 966 00:47:58,695 --> 00:48:00,560 - I wouldn't say a single word to them. 967 00:48:00,697 --> 00:48:02,562 I would listen to what they have to say. 968 00:48:02,699 --> 00:48:05,327 And that's what no one did. 969 00:48:05,469 --> 00:48:08,063 - I'm Nicole Shleif. - And I'm Amanda Lamontagne. 970 00:48:08,205 --> 00:48:10,173 - And you went to Columbine? - Yes. 971 00:48:10,307 --> 00:48:12,400 - And you were with Eric and Dylan? 972 00:48:12,542 --> 00:48:14,407 In their class? - Yeah, 973 00:48:14,544 --> 00:48:17,069 we were in their bowling class. - In their bowling class? 974 00:48:17,214 --> 00:48:19,079 - Yes. - What's bowling class? 975 00:48:19,216 --> 00:48:22,913 - Just an elective you can take for a gym credit. 976 00:48:23,053 --> 00:48:25,544 - Where's the educational value of this, though? 977 00:48:28,158 --> 00:48:30,023 - Um... I guess there isn't really any. 978 00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,025 - No, there's not. 979 00:48:32,162 --> 00:48:36,292 - I learned how to bowl a lot better, that's for sure. 980 00:48:36,433 --> 00:48:38,526 - What were Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold like? 981 00:48:38,668 --> 00:48:40,533 - Weird. - Yeah? 982 00:48:40,670 --> 00:48:42,535 - I mean, not very social. 983 00:48:42,672 --> 00:48:44,537 - I didn't really know who they were. 984 00:48:44,674 --> 00:48:48,166 - Not very social, just kinda kept to themselves. 985 00:48:48,311 --> 00:48:50,643 - How good a bowlers were Eric and Dylan? 986 00:48:50,781 --> 00:48:53,113 - When we played them, 987 00:48:53,250 --> 00:48:55,548 all I remember is they were just, like, crazy. 988 00:48:55,685 --> 00:48:57,949 They would just chuck the ball. - Chuck it down there. 989 00:48:58,088 --> 00:49:01,057 - Throw the ball down; didn't really care how they bowled. 990 00:49:01,191 --> 00:49:03,352 - Yeah, they didn't really care about their scores. 991 00:49:03,493 --> 00:49:05,461 Deputy Sheriff Steve Davis - What were the suspects doing the morning of attack? 992 00:49:05,529 --> 00:49:07,190 I told you that I'd heard that they were bowling; 993 00:49:07,330 --> 00:49:09,093 that's the only thing I'm aware of. 994 00:49:09,232 --> 00:49:12,065 - So did Dylan and Eric show up that morning 995 00:49:12,202 --> 00:49:14,261 and bowl two games before moving on 996 00:49:14,404 --> 00:49:16,269 to shoot up the school? 997 00:49:16,406 --> 00:49:18,738 And did they just chuck the balls down the lane? 998 00:49:18,875 --> 00:49:20,740 Did this mean something? 999 00:49:20,877 --> 00:49:23,903 - Um, I guess they went to their favourite class. 1000 00:49:26,016 --> 00:49:27,540 - Why wasn't anyone blaming bowling 1001 00:49:27,684 --> 00:49:28,844 for warping the minds of Eric and Dylan 1002 00:49:28,952 --> 00:49:30,647 to commit their evil deeds? 1003 00:49:30,787 --> 00:49:35,156 Wasn't that just as plausible as blaming Marilyn Manson? 1004 00:49:35,292 --> 00:49:37,192 After all, 1005 00:49:37,327 --> 00:49:39,192 it was apparently the last thing they did 1006 00:49:39,329 --> 00:49:41,991 before the massacre. 1007 00:49:42,132 --> 00:49:44,862 But wait a minute. There's lots of bowling going on 1008 00:49:45,001 --> 00:49:48,493 in other countries. 1009 00:49:48,638 --> 00:49:51,004 And don't they listen to Marilyn Manson in Germany, 1010 00:49:51,141 --> 00:49:53,075 the home of sinister Goth music? 1011 00:49:53,210 --> 00:49:55,337 - Some Gothic festival. "Ah" 1012 00:49:55,479 --> 00:49:58,812 - Don't they watch the same violent movies in France? 1013 00:50:02,786 --> 00:50:05,584 Most of the violent video games are from Japan. 1014 00:50:08,225 --> 00:50:09,522 Many people in America believe 1015 00:50:09,659 --> 00:50:12,093 that it's the break-up of the family unit 1016 00:50:12,229 --> 00:50:14,129 that's caused so many wayward youth to turn to violence. 1017 00:50:14,264 --> 00:50:16,630 - I'll save you the trouble. I'll run away and kill myself! 1018 00:50:16,766 --> 00:50:19,132 How would you like that? You can't keep me here! 1019 00:50:19,269 --> 00:50:20,759 - But statistics show 1020 00:50:20,904 --> 00:50:22,997 that there are more broken homes and divorce 1021 00:50:23,139 --> 00:50:24,834 in Great Britain than in the U.S. 1022 00:50:24,975 --> 00:50:28,672 - It's official: Fergie's marriage has ended. 1023 00:50:28,812 --> 00:50:32,407 - Liberals contend that it's all the poverty we have in America 1024 00:50:32,549 --> 00:50:34,346 that causes all this violence. 1025 00:50:34,484 --> 00:50:36,577 But the unemployment rate in Canada 1026 00:50:36,720 --> 00:50:39,587 is twice what it is here. Of course, most people say 1027 00:50:39,723 --> 00:50:42,487 it's because we Americans have a violent history, 1028 00:50:42,626 --> 00:50:44,856 a violent past. Cowboys and Indians, 1029 00:50:44,995 --> 00:50:47,020 the Wild West, 1030 00:50:47,163 --> 00:50:49,097 a history of conquering and bloodshed. 1031 00:50:49,232 --> 00:50:51,097 Well, if that's all it takes to end up 1032 00:50:51,234 --> 00:50:53,464 with such a violent society 1033 00:50:53,603 --> 00:50:55,503 like we have in America, how do you explain this? 1034 00:50:56,306 --> 00:50:58,706 GERMANS EXTERMINATE 12 MILLION 1035 00:51:00,944 --> 00:51:03,037 JAPANESE OCCUPATION OF CHINA 1036 00:51:06,683 --> 00:51:09,777 FRENCH MASSACRE IN ALGIERS 1037 00:51:12,756 --> 00:51:15,589 BRITISH SLAUGHTER IN INDIA 1038 00:51:17,027 --> 00:51:19,018 Yet in spite of all this, 1039 00:51:19,162 --> 00:51:20,527 how many people are killed by guns each year? 1040 00:51:22,632 --> 00:51:24,725 In Germany: 1041 00:51:26,469 --> 00:51:28,130 In France: 1042 00:51:31,107 --> 00:51:33,405 In Canada: 1043 00:51:36,179 --> 00:51:38,147 In the United Kingdom: 1044 00:51:41,117 --> 00:51:43,142 In Australia: 1045 00:51:45,722 --> 00:51:46,950 In Japan: 1046 00:51:49,759 --> 00:51:51,659 In the United States: 1047 00:51:56,232 --> 00:51:59,998 - But that, to me, brings up an important question: 1048 00:52:00,136 --> 00:52:02,604 Then what is so different about Americans? 1049 00:52:02,739 --> 00:52:04,866 Tom Mauser Father of Columbine victim 1050 00:52:05,075 --> 00:52:06,201 Are we homicidal in nature? 1051 00:52:07,611 --> 00:52:10,512 Because in Europe and Australia, 1052 00:52:10,647 --> 00:52:13,115 most other free-world countries, they don't have this. 1053 00:52:13,249 --> 00:52:16,616 They don't have people who snap and go on murderous rampages. 1054 00:52:16,753 --> 00:52:19,221 - Well, no, they're just like us. They have the occasional person 1055 00:52:19,356 --> 00:52:21,620 that snaps and kills a lot of people. 1056 00:52:21,758 --> 00:52:24,591 How about a British soccer riot? Those aren't Quakers there, 1057 00:52:24,728 --> 00:52:26,719 - Every time that I bring up comparisons 1058 00:52:26,863 --> 00:52:28,728 with other free-world countries, what I hear is: 1059 00:52:28,865 --> 00:52:30,890 "Oh, our culture is so different. We're so different." 1060 00:52:31,034 --> 00:52:33,059 And as you said, they have violent video games, 1061 00:52:33,203 --> 00:52:36,070 they have violent movies, they have alienated youth, 1062 00:52:36,206 --> 00:52:39,073 they - like us - don't have prayer in schools. 1063 00:52:39,209 --> 00:52:43,441 What is so radically different? What is it about us? 1064 00:52:43,580 --> 00:52:45,571 - What is it? - What is it? 1065 00:52:45,949 --> 00:52:47,576 - What is it? - What is it? 1066 00:52:47,717 --> 00:52:50,447 I don't know. 1067 00:52:52,889 --> 00:52:55,619 - Now, it's time for... 1068 00:52:55,725 --> 00:52:57,886 Hi, boys and girls. Ready to get started? 1069 00:52:58,028 --> 00:52:59,962 Once upon a time, there were these people in Europe 1070 00:53:00,096 --> 00:53:03,964 called pilgrims and they were afraid of being persecuted. 1071 00:53:04,100 --> 00:53:06,728 So they all got in a boat and sailed to the New World 1072 00:53:06,870 --> 00:53:09,532 where they wouldn't have to be scared ever again. 1073 00:53:09,673 --> 00:53:12,437 - Oh, I'm so relaxed. - I feel so much safer. 1074 00:53:12,575 --> 00:53:15,567 - But as soon as they arrived, they were greeted by savages. 1075 00:53:15,712 --> 00:53:17,907 They got scared all over again. - Injuns! 1076 00:53:18,048 --> 00:53:19,675 - So they killed them all. Now, you'd think 1077 00:53:19,816 --> 00:53:22,376 wiping out a race of people would calm them down, but no. 1078 00:53:22,519 --> 00:53:24,749 Instead, they started getting frightened of each other. 1079 00:53:24,888 --> 00:53:27,049 [ both ]: Witch! - So they burned witches. 1080 00:53:27,190 --> 00:53:28,555 In 1775, 1081 00:53:28,692 --> 00:53:31,456 they started killing the British, so they could be free. 1082 00:53:31,594 --> 00:53:34,358 And it worked. But they still didn't feel safe. 1083 00:53:34,497 --> 00:53:37,523 So they passed a 2nd amendment, which said every white man 1084 00:53:37,667 --> 00:53:39,828 could keep his gun. - I loves my gun, loves my gun. 1085 00:53:39,969 --> 00:53:42,767 - This brings us to the genius idea of slavery. 1086 00:53:42,906 --> 00:53:44,840 You see, boys and girls, the white people back then 1087 00:53:44,974 --> 00:53:47,306 were also afraid of doing any work. So they went to Africa, 1088 00:53:47,444 --> 00:53:49,605 kidnapped thousands of black people, brought them to America, 1089 00:53:49,746 --> 00:53:51,873 and forced them to work very hard for no money. 1090 00:53:52,015 --> 00:53:53,880 And I don't mean no money like: 1091 00:53:54,017 --> 00:53:55,780 "I work at Wal-Mart and make no money." 1092 00:53:55,919 --> 00:53:58,080 I mean zero dollars. Nothing, nada, zip. 1093 00:53:58,221 --> 00:54:00,086 Doing it that way made the USA 1094 00:54:00,223 --> 00:54:01,918 the richest country in the world. 1095 00:54:02,058 --> 00:54:04,083 So did having all that money and free help 1096 00:54:04,227 --> 00:54:07,094 calm the white people down? No way. They got even more afraid. 1097 00:54:07,230 --> 00:54:09,460 That's because after 200 years of slavery, 1098 00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:11,999 the black people now outnumbered the white people in many parts 1099 00:54:12,135 --> 00:54:14,365 of the South. Well, you can pretty much what came next. 1100 00:54:14,504 --> 00:54:16,404 The slaves started rebelling. There were uprisings 1101 00:54:16,539 --> 00:54:18,234 and old masters' heads got chopped off 1102 00:54:18,374 --> 00:54:20,672 and when white people heard of this, they were freaking out. 1103 00:54:20,810 --> 00:54:22,607 They going: - I want to live! 1104 00:54:22,746 --> 00:54:24,509 Don't kill me, big black man. 1105 00:54:24,647 --> 00:54:27,582 - Well, just in the nick of time came Samuel Colt, who, 1106 00:54:27,717 --> 00:54:30,515 in 1836, invented the first weapon ever that could be fired 1107 00:54:30,653 --> 00:54:32,416 over and over without having to reload. 1108 00:54:32,555 --> 00:54:35,183 And all the settlers were, like: - Yee-hah! 1109 00:54:35,325 --> 00:54:38,453 - But it was too late. The North soon won the Civil War 1110 00:54:38,595 --> 00:54:43,123 and the slaves were free to go chop the old masters' heads off. 1111 00:54:43,266 --> 00:54:45,496 Then everybody was, like: - Oh, no, we're gonna die. 1112 00:54:45,635 --> 00:54:48,001 - But the freed slaves took no revenge. 1113 00:54:48,138 --> 00:54:50,572 They just wanted to live in peace. 1114 00:54:50,707 --> 00:54:53,301 But you couldn't convince the white people of this. 1115 00:54:53,443 --> 00:54:56,435 So they formed the Ku Klux Klan and, in 1871, 1116 00:54:56,579 --> 00:54:59,548 the same year the Klan became an illegal terrorist organization, 1117 00:54:59,682 --> 00:55:03,379 another group was founded: the National Rifle Association. 1118 00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:05,488 Soon, politicians passed one of the first gun laws, 1119 00:55:05,622 --> 00:55:08,750 making it illegal for any black person to own one. 1120 00:55:08,892 --> 00:55:12,123 It was a great year for America. he KKK and the NRA. 1121 00:55:12,262 --> 00:55:14,127 Of course, they had nothing to do with each other; 1122 00:55:14,264 --> 00:55:16,892 it was a coincidence. One group legally promoted responsible 1123 00:55:17,033 --> 00:55:19,900 gun ownership; the other shot and lynched black people. 1124 00:55:20,036 --> 00:55:22,231 That's the way it was till 1955, when a black woman 1125 00:55:22,372 --> 00:55:25,273 broke the law by refusing to move to the back of the bus. 1126 00:55:25,408 --> 00:55:26,670 White people just couldn't believe it. 1127 00:55:26,810 --> 00:55:29,973 - Huh? Why won't she move? - What's going on? 1128 00:55:30,113 --> 00:55:33,048 - Man, all hell broke loose. Black people everywhere demanded 1129 00:55:33,183 --> 00:55:36,914 their rights. White people had a major, freaky-feel meltdown 1130 00:55:37,053 --> 00:55:39,544 and they were all, like: - Run away! Run away! 1131 00:55:39,689 --> 00:55:41,714 - And they did. They all ran fleeing to the suburbs, 1132 00:55:41,858 --> 00:55:44,326 where it was all white and safe and clean. And they went out 1133 00:55:44,460 --> 00:55:46,325 and bought a quarter-of-a-billion guns. 1134 00:55:46,462 --> 00:55:48,396 And put locks on their doors, alarms in their houses, 1135 00:55:48,531 --> 00:55:50,726 and gates around the neighbourhoods. 1136 00:55:50,867 --> 00:55:54,667 And finally, they were all safe and secure and snug as a bug. 1137 00:55:59,809 --> 00:56:03,836 And everyone lived happily ever after. 1138 00:56:15,091 --> 00:56:16,752 - Because if you turn on the evening news, 1139 00:56:16,893 --> 00:56:20,624 America still seems like a pretty scary place. 1140 00:56:20,763 --> 00:56:23,926 - Who is he? Is he dangerous? What's he up to? 1141 00:56:26,870 --> 00:56:28,462 - What are you trying to pull, man? 1142 00:56:28,605 --> 00:56:30,004 - Remember all the Y2Kscares? 1143 00:56:30,139 --> 00:56:33,472 Weren't we told that our very society was about to collapse 1144 00:56:33,610 --> 00:56:35,100 because somebody forgot 1145 00:56:35,245 --> 00:56:37,179 to type in a couple of digits on the computer? 1146 00:56:37,313 --> 00:56:39,611 - There's gonna be mass chaos and confusion. 1147 00:56:39,749 --> 00:56:41,114 - Tonight, the countdown begins. 1148 00:56:41,251 --> 00:56:43,116 All day, store director Rick Smith 1149 00:56:43,253 --> 00:56:47,485 watched consumers get Y2K ready. - Batteries sell extremely well. 1150 00:56:47,624 --> 00:56:50,388 The lamp oil, generators. 1151 00:56:50,526 --> 00:56:52,619 - After sending the country into a panic, 1152 00:56:52,762 --> 00:56:54,957 the clock struck midnight... 1153 00:56:55,098 --> 00:56:57,760 And nothing happened. 1154 00:56:57,901 --> 00:56:59,892 Or how about those killer bees 1155 00:57:00,036 --> 00:57:02,061 that were going to attack America? 1156 00:57:02,205 --> 00:57:04,730 - We're almost certain they'll arrive this year. 1157 00:57:04,874 --> 00:57:07,468 - Shmidt expects the Africanized bees to reach Texas this year, 1158 00:57:07,610 --> 00:57:09,840 cross into Arizona in about two to three years. 1159 00:57:09,979 --> 00:57:13,312 He's concerned because the killer bee is overly aggressive. 1160 00:57:13,449 --> 00:57:15,917 - They will follow you for half a mile. 1161 00:57:16,052 --> 00:57:18,577 - The bees never came. 1162 00:57:18,721 --> 00:57:21,189 Remember the first time you heard 1163 00:57:21,324 --> 00:57:24,088 that someone had hidden a razor blade in an apple at Halloween? 1164 00:57:24,227 --> 00:57:25,751 Before long, 1165 00:57:25,895 --> 00:57:28,159 kids were not permitted to go out in the dark on Halloween 1166 00:57:28,298 --> 00:57:30,664 and go trick-or-treating at strangers' homes. 1167 00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:32,859 - Many people say they won't give out candy treats on Halloween. 1168 00:57:33,002 --> 00:57:35,664 It's too dangerous and they're too scared. 1169 00:57:35,805 --> 00:57:37,272 - Well, guess what? 1170 00:57:37,407 --> 00:57:39,170 There never was any razor blade in the apple. 1171 00:57:39,309 --> 00:57:41,402 In fact, only two kids 1172 00:57:41,544 --> 00:57:45,207 in the past 40 years have been killed by Halloween candy. 1173 00:57:45,348 --> 00:57:47,578 And both of them were poisoned on purpose by relatives. 1174 00:57:47,717 --> 00:57:49,275 - Bye. 1175 00:57:49,419 --> 00:57:51,853 [ reporter]: It was like a scene from a horror movie. 1176 00:57:51,988 --> 00:57:55,287 This man was mowing his lawn when a fox darted out 1177 00:57:55,425 --> 00:57:57,791 of the woods and attacked his riding-mower. 1178 00:57:57,927 --> 00:58:00,191 - A warning about a popular weight-loss supplement. 1179 00:58:00,330 --> 00:58:02,298 What you don't know may kill you. 1180 00:58:02,432 --> 00:58:04,559 - You ride them every day, but in an instant, 1181 00:58:04,701 --> 00:58:07,795 an escalator can mangle you or a loved one. 1182 00:58:07,937 --> 00:58:11,304 - We reveal why you may be riding on stairway to danger. 1183 00:58:11,441 --> 00:58:12,373 - You might want to take some extra precautions: 1184 00:58:12,508 --> 00:58:15,033 keep a low profile, don't go around dancing 1185 00:58:15,178 --> 00:58:17,738 with a bunch of Americans in the streets. 1186 00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:20,678 Make sure that you don't draw a lot of attention to yourself 1187 00:58:20,817 --> 00:58:22,148 and the fact that you're American. 1188 00:58:22,285 --> 00:58:24,753 - Nation's top doctor says one in five Americans 1189 00:58:24,887 --> 00:58:26,718 suffers some form of mental disorder. 1190 00:58:26,856 --> 00:58:29,347 The surgeon general David Satcher pleads with people 1191 00:58:29,492 --> 00:58:31,221 to seek help now. 1192 00:58:31,361 --> 00:58:34,990 - The media, the corporations, the politicians, 1193 00:58:35,131 --> 00:58:39,192 have all done such a good job of scaring the American public, 1194 00:58:39,335 --> 00:58:42,031 it's come to the point where they don't need to give 1195 00:58:42,171 --> 00:58:44,162 any reason at all. 1196 00:58:44,307 --> 00:58:47,003 - Today, the Justice Department did issue a... 1197 00:58:47,143 --> 00:58:49,577 a blanket alert. 1198 00:58:52,181 --> 00:58:55,275 It was in recognition of a general threat we received. 1199 00:58:55,418 --> 00:58:58,546 Uh, this is not the first time 1200 00:58:58,688 --> 00:59:00,952 the Justice Department have acted like this. 1201 00:59:01,090 --> 00:59:03,490 I hope it's the last. 1202 00:59:03,626 --> 00:59:07,528 But given the attitude of the evildoers, it may not be. 1203 00:59:14,103 --> 00:59:16,003 - I just love these boulevards down here, though. 1204 00:59:16,105 --> 00:59:17,697 You don't get this in most of L.A. 1205 00:59:17,874 --> 00:59:19,171 South Central Los Angeles 1206 00:59:19,375 --> 00:59:21,240 - How come whenever I'm out here, though, 1207 00:59:21,310 --> 00:59:23,574 I turn on the 11-o'clock news and I hear, you know: 1208 00:59:23,713 --> 00:59:26,079 "Tonight in South Central, drive-by shooting." 1209 00:59:26,215 --> 00:59:28,080 Or: "Tonight in South Central..." 1210 00:59:28,317 --> 00:59:30,683 Prof. Barry Glassner Author, "The Culture of Fear" 1211 00:59:30,887 --> 00:59:33,082 ...this, that or whatever. I mean, they're not making that up, are they? 1212 00:59:33,222 --> 00:59:35,986 - No, they're not making it up, but they're choosing 1213 00:59:36,125 --> 00:59:39,390 what they're covering. If you turn on the TV, on the news, 1214 00:59:39,529 --> 00:59:41,895 what are you gonna hear about? 1215 00:59:42,031 --> 00:59:45,967 Dangerous black guys, right? Unnamed black guy who, you know, 1216 00:59:46,102 --> 00:59:49,162 accused of some crime or... - Right. 1217 00:59:49,305 --> 00:59:52,103 - You're gonna see pictures of black guys doing bad things, 1218 00:59:52,241 --> 00:59:54,607 and hearing stories about black guys doing bad things. 1219 00:59:54,744 --> 00:59:56,609 And we've heard this our whole lives. 1220 00:59:56,746 --> 00:59:58,976 - Now, the suspect is a black male in his twenties. 1221 00:59:59,115 --> 01:00:01,106 We are told he has a large afro, sideburns, 1222 01:00:01,250 --> 01:00:03,377 he was wearing a silver chain at the time. 1223 01:00:03,519 --> 01:00:05,612 - Police say the suspect is a black man. 1224 01:00:05,755 --> 01:00:10,124 Six foot one, 160 to 180 pounds, about 35 years in age. 1225 01:00:10,259 --> 01:00:12,921 - Suspect is a black male, age 16 to 18. 1226 01:00:13,062 --> 01:00:15,030 - The suspect is African-American. 1227 01:00:15,164 --> 01:00:16,461 Police believe-- - Police say-- 1228 01:00:16,599 --> 01:00:18,965 - The black man-- [ several ]: Suspect-- 1229 01:00:19,102 --> 01:00:21,229 - The suspect is a black male - A black man. 1230 01:00:21,370 --> 01:00:23,600 [ various voices ]: A black... black... black... 1231 01:00:23,739 --> 01:00:24,865 - A black man. 1232 01:00:25,007 --> 01:00:27,498 - Susan Smith drowns her two children. 1233 01:00:27,643 --> 01:00:30,077 She tells people a black guy... - Correct. 1234 01:00:30,213 --> 01:00:33,341 - Stole the car and stole the kids. 1235 01:00:33,483 --> 01:00:36,008 And everyone, at first, bought it. 1236 01:00:36,152 --> 01:00:39,144 - Some guy jumped into her car, with her two kids in it. 1237 01:00:39,288 --> 01:00:41,381 Then he took off. That's a black guy, she says. 1238 01:00:41,524 --> 01:00:43,958 - Black male? - Yes, Ma'am. 1239 01:00:44,093 --> 01:00:46,857 - And I told them I loved them. I hollered I loved them 1240 01:00:46,996 --> 01:00:49,123 And it's just a tragedy. 1241 01:00:49,265 --> 01:00:53,133 - The anonymous urban - which means usually black - 1242 01:00:53,269 --> 01:00:55,100 male, comes by and does this. 1243 01:00:55,238 --> 01:00:57,365 It's the excuse for all kinds of things. 1244 01:00:57,507 --> 01:00:59,065 - Charles Stewart, a lawyer in Boston... 1245 01:00:59,208 --> 01:01:01,176 - Right, exactly. - ...kills his pregnant wife, 1246 01:01:01,310 --> 01:01:03,642 says a black guy did it; everybody buys it. 1247 01:01:03,779 --> 01:01:06,805 - The suspect described as a black male about six feet tall. 1248 01:01:06,949 --> 01:01:09,179 Chuck and Carol Stewart were robbed at gunpoint 1249 01:01:09,318 --> 01:01:11,183 as they left a Lamaze class. 1250 01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:13,311 It seemed the ultimate urban nightmare. 1251 01:01:13,456 --> 01:01:15,720 - You know, the thing I love about this country of mine, 1252 01:01:15,858 --> 01:01:18,349 is that whether you're a psychotic killer 1253 01:01:18,494 --> 01:01:20,985 or running for president of the United States, 1254 01:01:21,130 --> 01:01:23,564 the one thing you can always count on 1255 01:01:23,699 --> 01:01:26,827 is white America's fear of the black man. 1256 01:01:26,969 --> 01:01:29,836 - We've heard the stories on the news and in the papers 1257 01:01:29,972 --> 01:01:31,837 and they have killed people. 1258 01:01:31,974 --> 01:01:33,669 Killer bees, also known 1259 01:01:33,809 --> 01:01:35,276 as "Africanized" bees. 1260 01:01:35,411 --> 01:01:37,675 - I'm scared. I'm really worried. 1261 01:01:37,813 --> 01:01:41,010 - Rose Shipley never expected a nest of Africanized killer bees 1262 01:01:41,150 --> 01:01:43,345 to shack up across the street from her. 1263 01:01:43,486 --> 01:01:46,512 - But I'm terribly allergic to them and so are my grandkids. 1264 01:01:46,656 --> 01:01:48,214 - They're originally from southern and eastern Africa. 1265 01:01:48,357 --> 01:01:52,054 Dr. Warrick Care brought some to Brazil in 1956 1266 01:01:52,195 --> 01:01:54,186 and tried to mate them 1267 01:01:54,330 --> 01:01:57,094 with the European bee, the kind that we're used to. 1268 01:01:57,233 --> 01:02:00,634 But they got loose and moved to the southern United States. 1269 01:02:00,770 --> 01:02:02,237 - The main difference between a traditional honey bee 1270 01:02:02,371 --> 01:02:05,431 and an Africanized bee is the bee's aggressiveness. 1271 01:02:05,575 --> 01:02:08,738 If I was to do this to an Africanized bee's hive, 1272 01:02:08,878 --> 01:02:12,041 I could have several hundred stings in a matter of minutes. 1273 01:02:12,181 --> 01:02:14,479 - Danny Self raises the kinder, gentler European bees, 1274 01:02:14,617 --> 01:02:16,107 and he's done the research. 1275 01:02:16,252 --> 01:02:17,947 - The only way that you can tell 1276 01:02:18,087 --> 01:02:20,817 the two of them, is doing measurements on the body parts. 1277 01:02:20,957 --> 01:02:23,687 - Quite frankly, the black community has become 1278 01:02:23,826 --> 01:02:26,158 entertainment for the rest of the community. 1279 01:02:26,229 --> 01:02:27,662 - Meaning what? 1280 01:02:27,863 --> 01:02:29,125 Arthur Busch County Prosecutor - Flint, Michigan 1281 01:02:29,198 --> 01:02:31,063 - The entertainment being that the crime of the day - 1282 01:02:31,200 --> 01:02:33,065 you know, "If it bleeds, it leads" - 1283 01:02:33,202 --> 01:02:37,070 gets to be the front story and then that becomes the perception 1284 01:02:37,206 --> 01:02:40,573 and the image of an entire people. 1285 01:02:40,710 --> 01:02:43,577 Which couldn't be further from the truth, in my opinion. 1286 01:02:43,713 --> 01:02:46,580 In fact, you'll find, I think, 1287 01:02:46,716 --> 01:02:49,810 most African-Americans are quite adverse to gun possession. 1288 01:02:51,887 --> 01:02:53,650 In suburbia, I think, 1289 01:02:53,823 --> 01:02:55,654 there's some notion that there's going to be an invading horde, 1290 01:02:55,791 --> 01:02:59,818 come from either the city or from someplace unknown, 1291 01:02:59,962 --> 01:03:03,261 to savage their suburban community. 1292 01:03:03,399 --> 01:03:09,167 To me, not only is it bizarre, but it's totally, uh... 1293 01:03:09,305 --> 01:03:11,773 unfounded. 1294 01:03:11,907 --> 01:03:13,534 And these pistols, curiously enough, 1295 01:03:13,676 --> 01:03:17,112 weren't being taken off kids in the city of Flint, 1296 01:03:17,246 --> 01:03:20,113 but were being taken off of kids out in the out-county area, 1297 01:03:20,249 --> 01:03:24,049 in the suburban communities. And-- 1298 01:03:24,186 --> 01:03:26,051 - I didn't think that's what you were gonna say. 1299 01:03:26,188 --> 01:03:29,055 I thought you were gonna say that it's all these black kids 1300 01:03:29,191 --> 01:03:31,056 in the inner-city schools that had these guns. 1301 01:03:31,193 --> 01:03:33,559 - No, that's... 1302 01:03:33,696 --> 01:03:38,565 We've never really had many problems with guns in the city. 1303 01:03:38,701 --> 01:03:41,067 Not to say that we haven't; we've had some. 1304 01:03:41,203 --> 01:03:43,068 But that's never been the biggest problem. 1305 01:03:43,205 --> 01:03:45,571 The biggest problem has been the gun possession 1306 01:03:45,708 --> 01:03:49,200 by these adolescents in suburbia. 1307 01:03:49,345 --> 01:03:51,711 - How'd you get a gun? 1308 01:03:51,847 --> 01:03:54,577 - I stole mine. I stole it from a friend of mine. 1309 01:03:54,717 --> 01:03:56,412 His dad owns a bunch of guns. 1310 01:03:56,552 --> 01:03:58,417 - What we're you doing with the stolen guns? 1311 01:03:58,554 --> 01:04:00,419 - We went down to Detroit and started selling them. 1312 01:04:00,556 --> 01:04:04,549 'Cause I can get, like, a buck fifty a pop for a 9-millimetre. 1313 01:04:04,694 --> 01:04:07,561 - Oh, really. Who were you trying to sell them to? 1314 01:04:07,697 --> 01:04:10,723 - Anybody that would really want 'em. Gangs and stuff like that. 1315 01:04:10,866 --> 01:04:14,029 - Gangs in the city of Detroit? - Yeah. 1316 01:04:14,170 --> 01:04:15,933 - Black? - Uh, predominantly. Yeah. 1317 01:04:16,072 --> 01:04:17,937 - Yeah. So now you're out now, you're okay. 1318 01:04:18,074 --> 01:04:19,939 - Yeah, I'm free now. I'm completely clear. 1319 01:04:20,076 --> 01:04:22,442 - You can keep selling guns. - I can't keep selling guns. 1320 01:04:22,578 --> 01:04:24,375 It's getting too risky. Everybody knows me up here. 1321 01:04:24,513 --> 01:04:27,380 People want guns, drugs or alcohol, they come to my house 1322 01:04:27,516 --> 01:04:29,040 and that's just too much. 1323 01:04:29,185 --> 01:04:31,016 - Yeah, too much hassle. - Yeah. 1324 01:04:31,153 --> 01:04:37,217 - My favourite statistic in all the research I did discovered 1325 01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:41,456 that the murder rate had gone down by 20%. The coverage - 1326 01:04:41,597 --> 01:04:45,055 that is, how many murders are on the evening news - 1327 01:04:45,201 --> 01:04:47,396 it went up by 600%. 1328 01:04:47,536 --> 01:04:52,064 - The American people are conditioned by network TV, 1329 01:04:52,208 --> 01:04:54,073 by local news, 1330 01:04:54,210 --> 01:04:56,075 to believe that their communities are 1331 01:04:56,212 --> 01:04:59,079 much more dangerous than they actually are. 1332 01:04:59,215 --> 01:05:01,080 For example, here, in this community, 1333 01:05:01,217 --> 01:05:05,085 crime has decreased every year for the past eight years. 1334 01:05:05,221 --> 01:05:07,382 Yet, gun ownership, particularly handgun ownership, 1335 01:05:07,523 --> 01:05:09,388 is on the increase. 1336 01:05:09,525 --> 01:05:12,085 - Crime rates have been dropping, dropping, dropping. 1337 01:05:12,228 --> 01:05:15,595 Fear of crime has been going up, up, up. 1338 01:05:15,731 --> 01:05:18,097 How can that be possible? It doesn't make any sense. 1339 01:05:18,234 --> 01:05:21,601 But it makes perfect sense when you see what we're hearing 1340 01:05:21,737 --> 01:05:24,638 from politicians and seeing in the news media. 1341 01:05:24,774 --> 01:05:26,799 - So we're, uh, we're right here 1342 01:05:26,942 --> 01:05:29,433 on the corner of Florence and Normandie. 1343 01:05:29,578 --> 01:05:31,443 It's kind of Ground Zero for the L.A. riots. 1344 01:05:31,580 --> 01:05:32,740 - Right. 1345 01:05:32,882 --> 01:05:35,908 - You know, if a couple of white guys 1346 01:05:36,051 --> 01:05:38,144 would go down and walk around South Central, 1347 01:05:38,287 --> 01:05:39,185 they're gonna get killed. 1348 01:05:39,321 --> 01:05:41,516 Which I can tell you is a common perception. 1349 01:05:41,657 --> 01:05:44,057 The odds that something's going to happen to us 1350 01:05:44,193 --> 01:05:46,058 are really, really slight. 1351 01:05:46,195 --> 01:05:48,060 Minuscule. - Right. Okay. 1352 01:05:48,197 --> 01:05:50,062 - But you know, if you look up there, 1353 01:05:50,199 --> 01:05:53,066 you get a different symbol of the Hollywood sign. 1354 01:05:53,202 --> 01:05:55,067 It means something very different 1355 01:05:55,204 --> 01:05:57,069 than the corner of Florence and Normandie. 1356 01:05:57,206 --> 01:05:59,071 For most Americans and most of the world, 1357 01:05:59,208 --> 01:06:02,075 it means glamour and Hollywood, except that we can't see it. 1358 01:06:02,211 --> 01:06:04,076 - I can't see the Hollywood sign. Where is it? 1359 01:06:04,213 --> 01:06:06,579 - Right. You can't see it because of something that's probably... 1360 01:06:06,715 --> 01:06:08,580 much more dangerous for us right now, 1361 01:06:08,717 --> 01:06:10,582 which is the stuff we're breathing. 1362 01:06:10,719 --> 01:06:12,584 - The pollution that's blocking the Hollywood sign, 1363 01:06:12,721 --> 01:06:14,279 we're breathing this. 1364 01:06:14,423 --> 01:06:17,085 That's far more dangerous than all the other stuff the media's 1365 01:06:17,226 --> 01:06:19,057 telling us to be afraid of. - Right. 1366 01:06:19,195 --> 01:06:21,925 - As we left the corner of Florence and Normandie, 1367 01:06:22,064 --> 01:06:23,861 I noticed that a number of helicopters 1368 01:06:23,999 --> 01:06:26,194 had appeared in the sky. 1369 01:06:26,335 --> 01:06:28,132 Within seconds, the news media 1370 01:06:28,270 --> 01:06:30,135 started to arrive. - So what's the story here? 1371 01:06:30,272 --> 01:06:32,638 - I'm waiting. I thought you would know. 1372 01:06:32,775 --> 01:06:34,640 - No, I don't know anything. 1373 01:06:34,777 --> 01:06:37,541 - The Sergeant just told me there's a guy with a gun. 1374 01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:39,545 But they're not sure. That's all they told me. 1375 01:06:39,682 --> 01:06:41,809 Since there's no action, I'm not getting my camera down. 1376 01:06:41,951 --> 01:06:44,317 - I just happened to see the chopper, going to another story. 1377 01:06:44,453 --> 01:06:46,819 - What story are you going to? - It's a near-drowning. 1378 01:06:46,956 --> 01:06:48,480 - It's a drowning? - A near-drowning. 1379 01:06:48,624 --> 01:06:50,489 - How about a story about how you can't see 1380 01:06:50,626 --> 01:06:52,560 the Hollywood Hills because of the pollution? 1381 01:06:52,695 --> 01:06:55,562 Could you maybe do a story on that tonight? 1382 01:06:55,698 --> 01:06:58,667 - Pollution, that's rather good. I find that good. 1383 01:06:58,801 --> 01:07:01,167 You can't see it. You can't see anything around here. 1384 01:07:01,303 --> 01:07:04,170 - If you have to choose between a guy with a gun 1385 01:07:04,306 --> 01:07:07,070 and a near-drowning of a baby - you could only be one place-- 1386 01:07:07,209 --> 01:07:08,972 - I go with the gun. - You go with the gun, always. 1387 01:07:11,247 --> 01:07:13,078 Is it all over, here? It's all over? All over? 1388 01:07:13,215 --> 01:07:15,080 - Not yet, not yet. - Looks like it. 1389 01:07:15,217 --> 01:07:17,583 - Just wait for these sergeants down here to come down, 1390 01:07:17,720 --> 01:07:19,585 'cause they got all the details. 1391 01:07:19,722 --> 01:07:21,587 - Okay. Hey, I was just wondering - 1392 01:07:21,724 --> 01:07:25,023 I just got here to L.A. today - I can't see the Hollywood sign, 1393 01:07:25,160 --> 01:07:27,025 down on the hills there, down Normandie. 1394 01:07:27,162 --> 01:07:29,027 You can't see the sign 'cause of the pollution. 1395 01:07:29,164 --> 01:07:31,029 - Right. - Is there anybody you can arrest 1396 01:07:31,166 --> 01:07:33,532 for polluting up the air? - Absolutely not. 1397 01:07:33,669 --> 01:07:35,534 - Nobody? - No. 1398 01:07:35,671 --> 01:07:37,070 - Why is that? 1399 01:07:39,008 --> 01:07:40,908 Why is that, Sergeant? 1400 01:07:47,383 --> 01:07:48,907 - He's fighting! 1401 01:07:49,051 --> 01:07:50,916 - For over a decade, 1402 01:07:51,053 --> 01:07:54,147 there has been one show on American television 1403 01:07:54,290 --> 01:07:56,724 that has consistently brought black and white people together 1404 01:07:56,859 --> 01:07:59,054 in an effort to reduce our fears 1405 01:07:59,194 --> 01:08:02,061 and celebrate our diversity. 1406 01:08:02,197 --> 01:08:04,222 That show is Cops. 1407 01:08:07,603 --> 01:08:09,833 I went to see a former producer of "Cops" 1408 01:08:09,972 --> 01:08:11,303 and executive producer 1409 01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,271 of World's Wildest Police Videos: 1410 01:08:13,409 --> 01:08:15,070 Mr. Dick Herland. 1411 01:08:15,210 --> 01:08:17,075 - Look "liberal" up in the dictionary 1412 01:08:17,212 --> 01:08:19,077 and I think my picture's in there somewhere, 1413 01:08:19,214 --> 01:08:24,015 - So then, you know, why not be compelled to do, you know, 1414 01:08:24,153 --> 01:08:29,022 a show that focuses on, you know, what's causing the crime, 1415 01:08:29,158 --> 01:08:31,524 as opposed to just chasing the criminals down? 1416 01:08:31,660 --> 01:08:34,026 - Because I think it's harder to do that show. 1417 01:08:34,163 --> 01:08:36,097 I don't know what that show would be. 1418 01:08:36,231 --> 01:08:38,028 Anger does well, hate does well, violence does well. 1419 01:08:38,167 --> 01:08:40,533 Tolerance and understanding and trying to learn to be 1420 01:08:40,669 --> 01:08:43,604 a little different than you were last year does less well. 1421 01:08:43,739 --> 01:08:45,604 - Does less well in the ratings. - Oh yeah. 1422 01:08:45,741 --> 01:08:48,539 - Maybe because we, in the television business, 1423 01:08:48,677 --> 01:08:52,545 because we tend to demonize black and Hispanic people, 1424 01:08:52,681 --> 01:08:54,546 then those watching it at home are going: 1425 01:08:54,683 --> 01:08:56,548 "I don't want to help those people. 1426 01:08:56,685 --> 01:08:58,550 I'm not going to do anything to help them. 1427 01:08:58,687 --> 01:09:01,053 Because I hate them now, because they may hurt me." 1428 01:09:01,190 --> 01:09:04,057 You know what I'm saying? - I know what you're saying, 1429 01:09:04,193 --> 01:09:06,559 I'm not sure that's what we're doing. 1430 01:09:06,695 --> 01:09:09,061 I'm not sure we're demonizing 1431 01:09:09,198 --> 01:09:13,567 black and Hispanic people, uh... particularly. 1432 01:09:13,702 --> 01:09:16,068 I don't think we show black and Hispanic people 1433 01:09:16,205 --> 01:09:19,572 as being criminals. 1434 01:09:19,708 --> 01:09:21,972 I'd like to say not more often, 1435 01:09:22,111 --> 01:09:24,079 but probably they are more often. 1436 01:09:24,213 --> 01:09:27,649 But I certainly don't think... We're certainly not trying 1437 01:09:27,783 --> 01:09:29,648 to demonize black and Hispanic people. 1438 01:09:29,785 --> 01:09:32,583 - We show them on the news, we show them on TV, 1439 01:09:32,721 --> 01:09:35,087 as pretty scary people. 1440 01:09:35,224 --> 01:09:37,954 - Yeah. 1441 01:09:38,093 --> 01:09:40,084 And I agree. I'd like to see that reversed 1442 01:09:40,229 --> 01:09:44,097 as much as possible. I... 1443 01:09:44,233 --> 01:09:46,098 - Start tonight. - Well, the thing is, 1444 01:09:46,235 --> 01:09:48,100 I don't know how to start tonight. 1445 01:09:48,237 --> 01:09:50,102 I don't know how to tell that story. 1446 01:09:50,239 --> 01:09:52,104 If I was smart enough to do that... 1447 01:09:52,241 --> 01:09:54,607 - I'll pitch you one. - Okay. All right. 1448 01:09:54,743 --> 01:09:57,109 - Um... um... 1449 01:09:57,246 --> 01:09:59,578 Do a show called not Cops but Corporate Cops. 1450 01:10:02,418 --> 01:10:03,442 "Corporation man Hey Corporate man 1451 01:10:03,585 --> 01:10:06,076 "We're coming out to get you better run while you can 1452 01:10:06,455 --> 01:10:09,515 "We're coming out to get you better run while you can" 1453 01:10:09,658 --> 01:10:11,626 - Uh... I love the idea. 1454 01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:15,127 I don't think it would make very interesting reality TV. 1455 01:10:15,264 --> 01:10:18,631 Unless we can get those people to get in their SUVs 1456 01:10:18,767 --> 01:10:22,134 and drive really fast down the road away from the police. 1457 01:10:22,271 --> 01:10:24,364 - But I'm telling you, everyone in America 1458 01:10:24,506 --> 01:10:26,371 who's got just your basic, everyday job 1459 01:10:26,508 --> 01:10:28,976 is gonna love watching the boss 1460 01:10:29,111 --> 01:10:31,079 being chased down the street with his shirt off, 1461 01:10:31,213 --> 01:10:32,612 thrown to the ground 1462 01:10:32,748 --> 01:10:35,615 and a knee to the neck. I tell you, that is gonna get ratings. 1463 01:10:35,751 --> 01:10:38,618 - Yeah, I'm with you. And if I can find a police outfit 1464 01:10:38,754 --> 01:10:42,588 that would prosecute corporate criminals appropriately 1465 01:10:42,725 --> 01:10:44,590 and would go after them appropriately... In other words, 1466 01:10:44,727 --> 01:10:47,594 what you do to a man who's just stolen a lady's purse 1467 01:10:47,730 --> 01:10:49,595 with $85 to it, 1468 01:10:49,732 --> 01:10:53,099 than you need to do an appropriate response 1469 01:10:53,235 --> 01:10:57,103 to a man who has just stolen $85 million from indigent people, 1470 01:10:57,239 --> 01:10:59,104 then, boy, we're gonna be out there filming that. 1471 01:10:59,241 --> 01:11:02,108 But as a matter of fact, when police go after the guy 1472 01:11:02,244 --> 01:11:04,109 who's just stolen $85 million, 1473 01:11:04,246 --> 01:11:07,113 they treat him like he was a member of the city council - 1474 01:11:07,249 --> 01:11:10,616 as he may or may not be - and it's not exciting television. 1475 01:11:10,753 --> 01:11:13,119 If you could get that guy to take his shirt off... 1476 01:11:13,255 --> 01:11:15,120 - Right. 1477 01:11:15,257 --> 01:11:17,122 - Yeah, and throw his cellular phone at the police 1478 01:11:17,259 --> 01:11:19,124 as they come through the door, 1479 01:11:19,261 --> 01:11:22,253 try to jump out that window, then we'd have a show. 1480 01:11:22,397 --> 01:11:25,059 - You watch violence on TV in a place like Canada 1481 01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:27,065 and you know it's not happening next door. 1482 01:11:27,202 --> 01:11:31,070 You watch it here, and you know it is happening next door. 1483 01:11:31,206 --> 01:11:33,071 - Right. - I think that's... 1484 01:11:33,208 --> 01:11:35,073 I don't know what the difference is, 1485 01:11:35,210 --> 01:11:37,075 but there's a big difference. - Yeah, but why isn't... 1486 01:11:37,212 --> 01:11:39,077 Why isn't it happening in Canada? 1487 01:11:39,214 --> 01:11:42,081 Why aren't there, you know, 10,000 murders a year? 1488 01:11:42,217 --> 01:11:45,084 - I don't know, but I want to go to Canada to retire, 1489 01:11:45,220 --> 01:11:48,087 or something, 'cause it sounds like where we want to be. 1490 01:11:48,223 --> 01:11:51,090 I'd like to find out what that difference is. Wouldn't you? 1491 01:11:51,226 --> 01:11:53,126 - Yeah. Yeah, I'm trying to find out. 1492 01:11:59,334 --> 01:12:02,098 Where are you supposed to be right now? 1493 01:12:02,237 --> 01:12:04,102 - School. - School. 1494 01:12:04,239 --> 01:12:05,706 - School. 1495 01:12:05,841 --> 01:12:07,706 - Aren't you worried about what you're not learning? 1496 01:12:07,843 --> 01:12:09,708 - Nah, I'm mostly helping everybody else in the class. 1497 01:12:09,845 --> 01:12:13,042 Then I barely get to do my work. - How about you? You're not 1498 01:12:13,182 --> 01:12:16,208 worried about your education? - Well, I've got the textbook. 1499 01:12:16,351 --> 01:12:18,876 - Why do you think we have so many, uh... 1500 01:12:19,021 --> 01:12:21,216 gun murders in America? - Uh... 1501 01:12:21,356 --> 01:12:24,553 I have no idea. People must hate each other or something. 1502 01:12:24,693 --> 01:12:26,558 - Oh, you mean Canadians don't hate each other? 1503 01:12:26,695 --> 01:12:29,562 - Well, we do but we don't go to the point of shooting somebody 1504 01:12:29,698 --> 01:12:32,565 just to get revenge. - What do you do? 1505 01:12:32,701 --> 01:12:35,067 - I don't know. Tease them, maybe. 1506 01:12:35,204 --> 01:12:38,537 Make fun of them, ridicule them. - Throw eggs at them. 1507 01:12:38,674 --> 01:12:41,575 - How many gun murders in Sarnia this year? 1508 01:12:41,710 --> 01:12:43,575 - None. - Last year? 1509 01:12:43,712 --> 01:12:45,577 - I believe we had one, at the time. 1510 01:12:45,714 --> 01:12:47,579 - The year before that? 1511 01:12:47,716 --> 01:12:50,082 - I can't recall what we had in the way of-- 1512 01:12:50,219 --> 01:12:52,084 - Maybe one in the last three years? 1513 01:12:52,221 --> 01:12:54,086 - Probably, yes. - Mm-hm. 1514 01:12:54,223 --> 01:12:57,386 - Very low. Very low for this city. 1515 01:12:57,526 --> 01:12:59,391 - Well, of course, there's no murders here 1516 01:12:59,528 --> 01:13:01,393 because there's only 70,000 people 1517 01:13:01,530 --> 01:13:04,226 and it's the kissing capital of the world. 1518 01:13:04,366 --> 01:13:06,698 So I went down the river to another Canadian city 1519 01:13:06,835 --> 01:13:08,700 that was five times as large as Sarnia: 1520 01:13:08,837 --> 01:13:12,204 Windsor, Ontario, just across the river from Detroit. 1521 01:13:12,341 --> 01:13:16,141 I was sure there'd be more murders in Windsor. 1522 01:13:16,278 --> 01:13:19,145 Ever hear of anyone being shot by a gun in Windsor? 1523 01:13:19,281 --> 01:13:21,306 - No. No. 1524 01:13:21,450 --> 01:13:23,247 - You remember any murders here? 1525 01:13:23,385 --> 01:13:26,548 - Uh, there was one a long time ago. Probably-- 1526 01:13:26,688 --> 01:13:30,055 - How long ago? - Oh... 1527 01:13:30,192 --> 01:13:32,057 - In your lifetime? - In my lifetime, 1528 01:13:32,194 --> 01:13:35,652 probably around 15, 20 years ago, there was one murder. 1529 01:13:35,797 --> 01:13:37,765 - In fact, this Windsor policeman told me 1530 01:13:37,900 --> 01:13:39,265 that the only gun murder 1531 01:13:39,401 --> 01:13:41,562 he could recall in Windsor in the last three years 1532 01:13:41,703 --> 01:13:44,069 was committed by a guy from Detroit, 1533 01:13:44,206 --> 01:13:46,674 who had a stolen gun from Minnesota. 1534 01:13:46,808 --> 01:13:50,608 With nearly 400,000 people in the Windsor area, 1535 01:13:50,746 --> 01:13:55,012 there were simply no Canadians shooting other Canadians. 1536 01:13:55,150 --> 01:13:56,640 I thought it might be time 1537 01:13:56,785 --> 01:14:00,653 for some fun facts about Canada. 1538 01:14:00,789 --> 01:14:03,019 I hit the streets of New York to find out what 1539 01:14:03,158 --> 01:14:05,524 the average American thought about our friendly neighbour 1540 01:14:05,661 --> 01:14:07,094 to the north. 1541 01:14:07,229 --> 01:14:12,531 - Canadians don't watch as much violent movies as Americans do. 1542 01:14:16,972 --> 01:14:18,599 - That's wrong. 1543 01:14:18,740 --> 01:14:20,833 Hordes of young boys, all throughout Canada, 1544 01:14:20,976 --> 01:14:23,501 eagerly await the next Hollywood bloodbath. 1545 01:14:23,645 --> 01:14:26,045 - Then one of the guy gets his leg taken off. 1546 01:14:26,181 --> 01:14:29,048 - Oh, wow! - And there was a lot of girls, 1547 01:14:29,184 --> 01:14:32,642 and naked at one point. - I like that stuff. 1548 01:14:32,788 --> 01:14:35,814 - What movie did you see tonight? - Sixth Day. 1549 01:14:35,958 --> 01:14:38,859 - With Arnold Schwarzenegger? - Yeah. 1550 01:14:38,994 --> 01:14:40,859 - Did it make you want to come out here 1551 01:14:40,996 --> 01:14:42,861 and play this shoot-'em-up game? 1552 01:14:42,998 --> 01:14:45,193 - Well... yeah. 1553 01:14:45,334 --> 01:14:48,064 - There's no poverty in Canada like there is here... 1554 01:14:48,203 --> 01:14:50,171 in the States. 1555 01:14:50,305 --> 01:14:51,670 - Wrong again. 1556 01:14:51,740 --> 01:14:53,708 Mayor Mike Bradley Sarnia, Ontario, Canada 1557 01:14:53,809 --> 01:14:55,504 - Actually, we've also had a much higher unemployment rate. 1558 01:14:55,577 --> 01:14:58,205 When Michigan rate was running at 4%, we were still at 8-9%, 1559 01:14:58,313 --> 01:15:00,304 We seem to have an institutional unemployment rate. 1560 01:15:00,449 --> 01:15:02,679 - I think there'd mostly be white people in Canada. 1561 01:15:02,818 --> 01:15:05,685 - Hmm... that's strange, 'cause when I'm in Canada, 1562 01:15:05,821 --> 01:15:08,346 I see black people everywhere. 1563 01:15:08,490 --> 01:15:10,355 And yellow people, and brown people... 1564 01:15:10,492 --> 01:15:12,084 and 13% of the country is non-white. 1565 01:15:12,227 --> 01:15:14,354 So the Canadians are 1566 01:15:14,496 --> 01:15:17,693 pretty much just like us. And the reason that they have (Toronto, Canada) 1567 01:15:17,833 --> 01:15:21,098 so few murders has to be because they've got 1568 01:15:21,236 --> 01:15:23,534 so few guns. 1569 01:15:27,676 --> 01:15:30,440 What kind of guns do you own? - Uh, I hunt. 1570 01:15:30,579 --> 01:15:33,047 I own rifles and shotguns, and I own pistols. 1571 01:15:33,181 --> 01:15:36,548 - Mm-hm. So how many guns total? - Uh... Probably about seven. 1572 01:15:36,685 --> 01:15:38,118 - Seven guns? - Yeah. 1573 01:15:38,253 --> 01:15:40,050 - Do you have a gun? - I have a few. 1574 01:15:40,188 --> 01:15:43,055 - How many guns do you have? - Half a dozen. 1575 01:15:43,191 --> 01:15:46,558 - You could name how many people that own guns, that you know? 1576 01:15:46,695 --> 01:15:49,391 Two, three, a dozen? - More than that. 1577 01:15:49,531 --> 01:15:52,091 - There's a tremendous amount of gun ownership. 1578 01:15:52,234 --> 01:15:54,065 We're a large country geographically. 1579 01:15:54,202 --> 01:15:56,534 We grew up with hunting and fishing being a tradition. 1580 01:15:56,671 --> 01:15:59,071 - In Canada, with a population of just around 30 million - 1581 01:15:59,207 --> 01:16:01,072 there's about 10 million families - 1582 01:16:01,209 --> 01:16:03,074 and the best estimate is somewhere in the region 1583 01:16:03,211 --> 01:16:04,974 of seven-million guns. 1584 01:16:05,113 --> 01:16:06,410 - Wow! 1585 01:16:06,548 --> 01:16:08,778 Canada was one gun-loving, 1586 01:16:08,917 --> 01:16:11,750 gun-toting, gun-crazy country! 1587 01:16:13,388 --> 01:16:16,289 Where can you get a gun? - Uptown, any time I want. 1588 01:16:16,425 --> 01:16:17,653 - I see you're a Glock owner. 1589 01:16:17,793 --> 01:16:20,591 Where can I get a Glock in Canada? 1590 01:16:20,729 --> 01:16:23,095 - Most gun stores'll sell 'em to you 1591 01:16:23,231 --> 01:16:25,028 if you have the proper permits and stuff. 1592 01:16:25,167 --> 01:16:27,158 - In fact, despite all their tough gun laws, 1593 01:16:27,302 --> 01:16:29,065 take a look at what I, 1594 01:16:29,204 --> 01:16:31,798 a foreign citizen, was able to do 1595 01:16:31,940 --> 01:16:33,737 at the local Canadian Wal-Mart. 1596 01:16:33,875 --> 01:16:36,537 Where's the ammunition at? - Where's the ammunition? 1597 01:16:36,678 --> 01:16:38,077 - Yeah. - Back here. 1598 01:16:41,716 --> 01:16:44,583 What kind are you looking for? - You know, like, bullets. 1599 01:16:46,688 --> 01:16:48,349 That's right. 1600 01:16:48,490 --> 01:16:51,357 I could buy as much live ammunition as I wanted to 1601 01:16:51,493 --> 01:16:53,222 in Canada. You take American? 1602 01:16:53,361 --> 01:16:55,090 Do you lock your doors? 1603 01:16:55,230 --> 01:16:57,721 - No. - Are you afraid of anything? 1604 01:16:57,833 --> 01:16:59,767 Sarnia, Canada 1605 01:16:59,868 --> 01:17:03,304 - Nah, not really, no. - Do you lock your doors at night? 1606 01:17:03,438 --> 01:17:05,303 - No. - You don't lock your doors? 1607 01:17:05,440 --> 01:17:07,067 - No. - Well, what do you... 1608 01:17:07,209 --> 01:17:09,473 Are you afraid of anything? - Not really. 1609 01:17:09,611 --> 01:17:13,069 - Have you ever been broken into? - Yes, I have. Yeah. 1610 01:17:13,215 --> 01:17:15,581 - What happened? - They broke into my home. 1611 01:17:15,717 --> 01:17:17,582 I wasn't there. They broke in, 1612 01:17:17,719 --> 01:17:20,279 they stole some booze and cigarettes and they left. 1613 01:17:20,422 --> 01:17:22,686 So I figure it must've been some teenagers 1614 01:17:22,824 --> 01:17:26,590 out to have a little bit of fun. That's all they took, though. 1615 01:17:26,728 --> 01:17:28,457 Just some booze and some cigarettes. 1616 01:17:28,597 --> 01:17:30,462 - Have you ever been a victim of crime? 1617 01:17:30,599 --> 01:17:32,533 - Yes. - What kind of crime? 1618 01:17:32,667 --> 01:17:35,033 - Uh, I've had people walk in while I've been sleeping 1619 01:17:35,170 --> 01:17:38,037 and vandalize my home and steal from me. 1620 01:17:38,173 --> 01:17:41,040 - And that didn't want to make you lock your doors at night? 1621 01:17:41,176 --> 01:17:43,667 - No. No. 1622 01:17:43,812 --> 01:17:46,474 - As an American with three locks on his doors, 1623 01:17:46,615 --> 01:17:48,674 I found this all a bit confusing. 1624 01:17:48,817 --> 01:17:51,251 Even here, in Toronto, a city of millions, 1625 01:17:51,386 --> 01:17:52,853 people just didn't lock their doors. 1626 01:17:55,290 --> 01:17:57,053 So you don't lock your doors but we, Americans, do. Why is that? 1627 01:17:57,192 --> 01:17:59,820 - You must be afraid of your neighbour. 1628 01:17:59,961 --> 01:18:02,054 - Do you ever leave your doors unlocked at home? 1629 01:18:02,197 --> 01:18:04,563 - Yeah. - Yeah, you do? 1630 01:18:04,699 --> 01:18:06,564 Where do you live? - Right around here. 1631 01:18:06,701 --> 01:18:08,066 - Toronto? - Around here. 1632 01:18:08,203 --> 01:18:09,864 - You leave your doors unlocked? - Yeah. 1633 01:18:10,005 --> 01:18:11,870 - You'd think, as Americans, 1634 01:18:12,007 --> 01:18:15,568 that the lock is keeping people out of your place. 1635 01:18:15,710 --> 01:18:19,077 We, as Canadians, see it more as, uh... 1636 01:18:19,214 --> 01:18:22,581 when we lock the door, we're imprisoning ourselves inside. 1637 01:18:22,717 --> 01:18:24,514 - You don't want to do that. 1638 01:18:24,653 --> 01:18:26,518 - Not really, no. 1639 01:18:26,655 --> 01:18:30,386 We don't want to... No. 1640 01:18:30,525 --> 01:18:34,017 - I decided to go unannounced to a neighbourhood in Toronto 1641 01:18:34,162 --> 01:18:37,529 to see if this unlocked-door thing was true. 1642 01:18:37,666 --> 01:18:39,896 Oh, hi. I'm sorry. Just checking. 1643 01:18:44,673 --> 01:18:46,732 [ dog barking ] Oh, hello! 1644 01:18:53,682 --> 01:18:55,047 - Oh, hi. - Hi. 1645 01:18:55,183 --> 01:18:57,048 - Nobody locks their doors. 1646 01:18:57,185 --> 01:18:59,050 Nobody locks their doors in this town. 1647 01:18:59,187 --> 01:19:01,985 - You want to lock? - No, no, no. 1648 01:19:02,123 --> 01:19:04,057 Do you like living here? - I like it very much. 1649 01:19:04,192 --> 01:19:06,490 - Yeah? And the T-shirt? - The T-shirt too. 1650 01:19:06,628 --> 01:19:08,687 - This door was wide open. And you're not afraid? 1651 01:19:08,830 --> 01:19:11,128 - Should I be afraid? - I don't know. You live here. 1652 01:19:11,266 --> 01:19:13,325 - I don't think I'm afraid. - You're not, are you? 1653 01:19:13,468 --> 01:19:15,333 Thank you very much. - All right. No problem. 1654 01:19:15,470 --> 01:19:17,335 - I'm sorry about the intrusion. - No, no problem. 1655 01:19:17,472 --> 01:19:19,838 - Thank you for not shooting me. - No problem at all. 1656 01:19:19,975 --> 01:19:21,340 - Bye-bye. - Okay. 1657 01:19:21,476 --> 01:19:22,534 - As an American, 1658 01:19:22,677 --> 01:19:24,975 I gotta say this all seemed kind of strange. 1659 01:19:25,113 --> 01:19:26,876 Until I looked up at the TV 1660 01:19:27,015 --> 01:19:29,006 in the bar and noticed what they watched 1661 01:19:29,150 --> 01:19:30,082 for their evening news. 1662 01:19:30,218 --> 01:19:32,812 - They're friends of ours. 1663 01:19:32,954 --> 01:19:36,082 We'll certainly listen to them courteously and carefully, 1664 01:19:36,224 --> 01:19:39,887 but you don't just make war just 'cause someone says so. 1665 01:19:40,028 --> 01:19:43,930 - The Canadians weren't being pumped full of fear. 1666 01:19:44,065 --> 01:19:46,192 And their politicians seemed to talk kind of funny. 1667 01:19:46,368 --> 01:19:48,359 Mayor Mike Bradley Sarnia, Canada 1668 01:19:48,470 --> 01:19:50,768 - ...making sure they have good daycare, assistance for their parents 1669 01:19:50,872 --> 01:19:53,102 when they're elderly and need to be in an old-age home, 1670 01:19:53,241 --> 01:19:54,265 that they have proper health care that insures 1671 01:19:54,409 --> 01:19:56,741 that they won't lose their business or their house 1672 01:19:56,878 --> 01:19:58,641 because they can't afford their medical bills. 1673 01:19:58,780 --> 01:20:00,577 That's how you build a good society. 1674 01:20:00,715 --> 01:20:03,081 No one wins unless everyone wins. And you don't win 1675 01:20:03,218 --> 01:20:05,345 by beating up on people who can't defend themselves. 1676 01:20:05,487 --> 01:20:06,852 And that's been the approach, unfortunately, 1677 01:20:06,988 --> 01:20:09,354 that's been spreading with some of the right-wing governments 1678 01:20:09,491 --> 01:20:11,118 across North America. They pick onto people 1679 01:20:11,259 --> 01:20:13,386 that can't defend themselves and at the same time, 1680 01:20:13,528 --> 01:20:15,155 they're turning around and giving financial support 1681 01:20:15,297 --> 01:20:18,266 and tax breaks and tax benefits to people that don't need them. 1682 01:20:18,400 --> 01:20:21,631 - Where are the indigents in the city? Where do they live? 1683 01:20:21,770 --> 01:20:24,568 - Uh... indigent... uh... 1684 01:20:24,706 --> 01:20:27,072 - You act like you've never heard the word before. 1685 01:20:27,208 --> 01:20:29,073 - There's... We don't have that problem here, really. It's... 1686 01:20:29,210 --> 01:20:30,575 - So I asked him, 1687 01:20:30,712 --> 01:20:33,078 "Could you at least take me to a Canadian slum," 1688 01:20:33,214 --> 01:20:34,681 and well... 1689 01:20:34,816 --> 01:20:37,979 this is what a ghetto looks like in Canada. 1690 01:20:38,119 --> 01:20:41,247 Is this the same mentality that says, with Canadians, if someone 1691 01:20:41,389 --> 01:20:44,825 gets sick, they should actually be able to have health care? 1692 01:20:44,959 --> 01:20:46,824 - Yeah. - Oh, definitely. 1693 01:20:46,961 --> 01:20:49,088 - Yeah. - Yup. 1694 01:20:49,230 --> 01:20:50,595 - Why? 1695 01:20:50,732 --> 01:20:52,529 - Because! 1696 01:20:52,667 --> 01:20:54,532 - Human rights. Everyone's got the right to live. 1697 01:20:54,669 --> 01:20:56,534 - You just came out of the emergency room? 1698 01:20:56,671 --> 01:20:58,104 - Yes, I did. 1699 01:20:58,239 --> 01:21:00,605 - How much did you have to pay for your treatment? 1700 01:21:00,742 --> 01:21:02,607 - The bill is covered by our hospital plan. 1701 01:21:02,744 --> 01:21:04,609 - You're telling me you didn't have to pay anything? 1702 01:21:04,746 --> 01:21:06,236 - No, I don't. 1703 01:21:06,381 --> 01:21:08,747 - I have family that lives in the States. 1704 01:21:08,883 --> 01:21:11,249 They used to live in Canada and moved over there. 1705 01:21:11,386 --> 01:21:14,617 And it's so different. - They get afraid more easily. 1706 01:21:14,756 --> 01:21:16,621 - Oh, yeah. 1707 01:21:16,758 --> 01:21:18,623 Yeah, very much so. 1708 01:21:18,760 --> 01:21:22,628 'Cause everybody reacts over there just like that. 1709 01:21:22,764 --> 01:21:25,562 They don't stop and think. 1710 01:21:25,700 --> 01:21:30,069 First reaction is pull the gun out. "You're on my property." 1711 01:21:30,205 --> 01:21:33,572 You know, like... 1712 01:21:33,708 --> 01:21:36,871 I don't know. It's just different over here. 1713 01:21:37,011 --> 01:21:38,876 - Where do you live? - Detroit. (Windsor, Canada) 1714 01:21:39,013 --> 01:21:40,571 - Come over to Canada here for the night? 1715 01:21:40,715 --> 01:21:42,080 - Right. 1716 01:21:42,217 --> 01:21:45,311 - People are more open-minded here, a bit more welcoming. 1717 01:21:45,453 --> 01:21:48,081 - Feel any difference when you cross over to this country? 1718 01:21:48,223 --> 01:21:50,248 Be honest, now, come on. - It's a lot lighter. 1719 01:21:50,392 --> 01:21:52,257 - The segregation over there is definitely much more-- 1720 01:21:52,394 --> 01:21:54,259 - In the United States. - ...more intensified 1721 01:21:54,396 --> 01:21:56,261 in the States, yeah. - Yeah. 1722 01:21:56,398 --> 01:21:58,457 - So you can... You can feel it. 1723 01:21:58,600 --> 01:22:00,761 - Almost like they just let you be. 1724 01:22:00,902 --> 01:22:02,995 - That's Canada for you. 1725 01:22:03,138 --> 01:22:05,106 - Every time I turn on the TV in the States, 1726 01:22:05,240 --> 01:22:08,607 it's always about a murder here, a gunfight, hostile position... 1727 01:22:08,743 --> 01:22:12,110 - I just think the States, their view of things is fighting. 1728 01:22:12,247 --> 01:22:14,112 That's how they resolve everything. 1729 01:22:14,249 --> 01:22:17,116 If there's... there's something going on in another country, 1730 01:22:17,252 --> 01:22:19,117 they send people over to fight it and... 1731 01:22:19,254 --> 01:22:21,620 - They are the most powerful country in the world, though. 1732 01:22:21,756 --> 01:22:23,553 - Canada's more just, like, "Let's negotiate, 1733 01:22:23,691 --> 01:22:26,057 let's work something out." Where the States is, 1734 01:22:26,194 --> 01:22:28,594 "We'll kill you and that'll be the end of that." 1735 01:22:28,730 --> 01:22:33,565 - Um, if guns were... If more guns made people safer, 1736 01:22:33,701 --> 01:22:36,761 then America would be one of the safest countries in the world. 1737 01:22:36,905 --> 01:22:38,805 It isn't. It's the opposite. 1738 01:23:23,451 --> 01:23:25,419 - I heard that 911 call, you know, on TV someplace. 1739 01:23:25,553 --> 01:23:27,418 It was horrible. It was just... 1740 01:23:27,555 --> 01:23:29,284 - 'Cause he kept asking, "Where's the shooter?" 1741 01:23:29,424 --> 01:23:31,415 She said, "He's gone. I need some help." 1742 01:23:31,559 --> 01:23:32,958 - The little girl was in there too? 1743 01:23:33,094 --> 01:23:36,029 - She was on the floor, yes. 1744 01:23:36,164 --> 01:23:38,064 - And the police and the medics came, or... 1745 01:23:38,199 --> 01:23:40,064 - By the time the medics were here... 1746 01:23:40,201 --> 01:23:43,068 The medics had just come in and I remember him stepping in 1747 01:23:43,204 --> 01:23:46,071 and taking over the room. He said, "You have to leave." 1748 01:23:46,207 --> 01:23:48,072 - All right. - And then when the meds come in, 1749 01:23:48,209 --> 01:23:50,575 when the police come in, you're no longer in control. 1750 01:23:50,712 --> 01:23:53,579 They take over the building. - Was she still alive then? 1751 01:23:53,715 --> 01:23:55,979 - Her lips had become totally blue. 1752 01:23:58,586 --> 01:24:00,247 - Back in my hometown of Flint, Michigan, 1753 01:24:00,355 --> 01:24:04,052 a six-year-old first-grade boy, at Buell Elementary, 1754 01:24:04,192 --> 01:24:06,592 had found a gun at his uncle's house, 1755 01:24:06,728 --> 01:24:10,061 where he was staying because his mother was being evicted. 1756 01:24:10,198 --> 01:24:14,066 He brought the gun to school and shot another first-grader, 1757 01:24:14,202 --> 01:24:17,228 six-year-old Kayla Rolland. 1758 01:24:17,372 --> 01:24:19,602 With one bullet that passed through her body, 1759 01:24:19,741 --> 01:24:22,369 she fell to the floor and laid there dying 1760 01:24:22,510 --> 01:24:25,968 while her teacher called 911 for help. 1761 01:24:26,114 --> 01:24:27,945 No one knew why the little boy 1762 01:24:28,082 --> 01:24:29,640 wanted to shoot the little girl. 1763 01:24:29,784 --> 01:24:31,979 As if the city had not been through 1764 01:24:32,120 --> 01:24:33,144 enough horror and tragedy 1765 01:24:33,288 --> 01:24:35,654 in the past two decades, it was now home 1766 01:24:35,790 --> 01:24:38,918 to a new record: the youngest school shooting ever 1767 01:24:39,060 --> 01:24:40,925 in the United States. 1768 01:24:41,062 --> 01:24:43,724 On the morning of the shooting, 1769 01:24:43,865 --> 01:24:47,824 it only took the helicopters and satellite trucks 1770 01:24:47,969 --> 01:24:49,402 a half-hour to show up. 1771 01:24:49,537 --> 01:24:51,095 - They check in the truck. 1772 01:24:51,239 --> 01:24:54,174 You know, we're doing one in 30 minutes again. 1773 01:24:54,309 --> 01:24:56,174 - This evening, about seven o'clock, 1774 01:24:56,311 --> 01:24:59,041 will be a public memorial service. Hundreds of people 1775 01:24:59,180 --> 01:25:02,513 will mourn the loss of little Kayla, a tiny little girl 1776 01:25:02,650 --> 01:25:04,675 who loved pizza, teddy bears, 1777 01:25:04,819 --> 01:25:07,913 and who was taken away from us much too soon. Gina? 1778 01:25:08,056 --> 01:25:09,921 - Good morning, Christine. The funeral home now passing out 1779 01:25:10,058 --> 01:25:12,083 tens of thousands of these pink ribbons 1780 01:25:12,226 --> 01:25:14,592 to support the young girl's family. 1781 01:25:14,729 --> 01:25:17,095 Today will be an emotional day and has been already, 1782 01:25:17,231 --> 01:25:19,131 remembering little Kayla. 1783 01:25:19,267 --> 01:25:21,132 Jeff Ross, Fox-2 News. 1784 01:25:23,671 --> 01:25:25,070 - Nice job. 1785 01:25:27,175 --> 01:25:29,541 - Yeah, Michelle, we're having technical problems, okay? 1786 01:25:29,677 --> 01:25:32,703 Well, don't talk to me about it, call our sat truck. 1787 01:25:32,847 --> 01:25:34,712 I need a haircut, man. 1788 01:25:34,849 --> 01:25:38,046 I'm a pig. A rug. 1789 01:25:38,186 --> 01:25:39,585 Here we go. 1790 01:25:44,692 --> 01:25:46,557 Some too choked up even to speak about it. 1791 01:25:46,694 --> 01:25:48,559 There's a memorial service scheduled here 1792 01:25:48,696 --> 01:25:50,561 for seven o'clock tonight. 1793 01:25:50,698 --> 01:25:52,563 We're live in Flint, Michigan, this afternoon. 1794 01:25:52,700 --> 01:25:54,600 Jeff Ross, Q-13 Reports. 1795 01:25:59,207 --> 01:26:00,834 Thank you. - Thank you. 1796 01:26:00,908 --> 01:26:02,876 - Want some hairspray? 1797 01:26:02,944 --> 01:26:04,912 - I kind of need it, don't I? - Yeah, you do, 1798 01:26:04,979 --> 01:26:06,003 - I got some... 1799 01:26:06,080 --> 01:26:08,139 - I have some. I just didn't put it in. I didn't have a chance. 1800 01:26:08,216 --> 01:26:09,911 I have hurricane-proof hairspray. 1801 01:26:09,984 --> 01:26:14,318 This man prayed for Kayla then let the balloon go. 1802 01:26:14,455 --> 01:26:15,979 I say we have the colour picture, 1803 01:26:16,124 --> 01:26:17,182 not the black-and-white. 1804 01:26:17,325 --> 01:26:19,190 Plenty of media here that covered Columbine. 1805 01:26:19,327 --> 01:26:21,591 You know, there are some networks, especially, 1806 01:26:21,729 --> 01:26:24,527 that go from, unfortunately, tragedy to tragedy. 1807 01:26:24,666 --> 01:26:30,036 And, uh, I feel bad for them. Because that's all they see... 1808 01:26:30,171 --> 01:26:32,162 The tragedies. 1809 01:26:32,306 --> 01:26:35,400 We're just trying to crunch right now 1810 01:26:35,543 --> 01:26:37,534 for the five and the six. 1811 01:26:37,679 --> 01:26:41,740 Today, we're feeding CNN and Fox, so... 1812 01:26:41,883 --> 01:26:46,047 - The national media had never visited Buell Elementary, 1813 01:26:46,187 --> 01:26:49,054 or the Beecher school district in which it sat, 1814 01:26:49,190 --> 01:26:51,556 or this part of Flint ever before. 1815 01:26:51,693 --> 01:26:55,060 And few, if any, of these reporters bothered to visit it 1816 01:26:55,196 --> 01:26:57,061 even when they were here now. 1817 01:26:57,198 --> 01:27:00,565 If they had ventured just a block away from the school 1818 01:27:00,702 --> 01:27:02,567 or the funeral home, they might have seen 1819 01:27:02,704 --> 01:27:05,070 a different kind of tragedy that, perhaps, would contain 1820 01:27:05,206 --> 01:27:08,767 some answers as to why this little girl was dead. 1821 01:27:10,745 --> 01:27:13,077 For over 20 years, this impoverished area, 1822 01:27:13,214 --> 01:27:15,205 in the hometown 1823 01:27:15,349 --> 01:27:17,214 of the world's largest corporation, 1824 01:27:17,351 --> 01:27:19,945 had been ignored as completely as it had been destroyed. 1825 01:27:20,088 --> 01:27:23,421 With 87% of the students living below 1826 01:27:23,558 --> 01:27:25,423 the official poverty line, 1827 01:27:25,560 --> 01:27:29,257 Buell and Beecher, and Flint, did not fit into 1828 01:27:29,397 --> 01:27:31,558 the accepted and widely circulated story line 1829 01:27:31,699 --> 01:27:34,293 put forth by the nation's media. 1830 01:27:34,435 --> 01:27:38,633 That being the one about America 1831 01:27:38,773 --> 01:27:40,673 and its invincible economy. 1832 01:27:46,114 --> 01:27:48,480 The number-one cause of death among young people 1833 01:27:48,616 --> 01:27:51,813 in this part of Flint was homicide. The football field, 1834 01:27:51,953 --> 01:27:55,150 at Flint-Beecher, was sponsored by a funeral home. 1835 01:27:55,289 --> 01:27:58,918 The kids at Beecher have won 1836 01:27:59,060 --> 01:28:01,028 13 state track championships, 1837 01:28:01,162 --> 01:28:03,027 but they've never had 1838 01:28:03,164 --> 01:28:05,530 a home track meet. 1839 01:28:05,666 --> 01:28:07,566 Because around the football field, 1840 01:28:07,702 --> 01:28:09,533 all they have is this dirt ring. 1841 01:28:12,740 --> 01:28:16,267 Years ago, someone here named the streets, 1842 01:28:16,410 --> 01:28:19,675 in this part of town, after all the Ivy League schools, 1843 01:28:19,814 --> 01:28:23,113 as if they had dreamed of better days 1844 01:28:23,251 --> 01:28:25,549 and something greater for themselves. 1845 01:28:32,493 --> 01:28:35,860 - The children are doing well. 1846 01:28:35,997 --> 01:28:38,022 The faculty and staff are doing well. 1847 01:28:38,166 --> 01:28:40,031 But we don't forget. 1848 01:28:40,168 --> 01:28:42,966 We don't forget. 1849 01:28:43,104 --> 01:28:45,470 Just don't want this happening to anybody else, you know? 1850 01:28:45,606 --> 01:28:48,040 It's... [ She sighs ] 1851 01:28:48,176 --> 01:28:50,041 - I know. 1852 01:28:50,178 --> 01:28:54,046 I know. I don't want it to happen to anybody else either. 1853 01:28:54,182 --> 01:28:58,551 - Hmm... - It's okay. It's okay. 1854 01:28:58,686 --> 01:29:00,313 It's okay. 1855 01:29:00,688 --> 01:29:02,087 It's okay. 1856 01:29:06,694 --> 01:29:09,094 I'm sorry. - That's all right. 1857 01:29:12,200 --> 01:29:15,567 [ Charlton Heston ]: ...from my cold, dead hands! 1858 01:29:15,703 --> 01:29:18,570 [ cheering ] - Just as he did 1859 01:29:18,706 --> 01:29:21,937 after the Columbine shooting, Charlton Heston showed up 1860 01:29:22,076 --> 01:29:24,840 in Flint to have a big pro-gun rally. 1861 01:29:24,979 --> 01:29:26,844 - Freedom has never seen 1862 01:29:26,981 --> 01:29:31,077 greater peril nor needed you more urgently 1863 01:29:31,219 --> 01:29:33,346 to come to her defence than now. 1864 01:29:33,487 --> 01:29:35,079 - Before he came to Flint, Heston was interviewed 1865 01:29:35,223 --> 01:29:38,522 by the Georgetown Hoya about Kayla's death, 1866 01:29:38,659 --> 01:29:41,093 and even his own NRA website talked about it. 1867 01:29:41,229 --> 01:29:44,255 - We wanted to let the NRA know that we haven't forgotten 1868 01:29:44,398 --> 01:29:45,660 about Kayla Rolland. 1869 01:29:45,800 --> 01:29:48,268 How could they come here? To me, it's like they're rubbing 1870 01:29:48,402 --> 01:29:50,427 our nose in it. I was shocked 1871 01:29:50,571 --> 01:29:52,266 and appalled that they would come here. 1872 01:29:52,406 --> 01:29:55,671 - Heston was asked by a local reporter why he came to Flint 1873 01:29:55,810 --> 01:29:58,176 after the tragedy at Buell, 1874 01:29:58,312 --> 01:30:00,177 and what did the NRA have to say 1875 01:30:00,314 --> 01:30:02,339 about six-year-olds using guns. 1876 01:30:02,483 --> 01:30:07,352 - We spend $20 million every year 1877 01:30:07,488 --> 01:30:10,616 and then we teach you... to five and six-year-olds, 1878 01:30:10,758 --> 01:30:13,625 we say, "If you see a gun, don't touch it, 1879 01:30:13,761 --> 01:30:16,127 leave the room, call an adult." 1880 01:30:16,264 --> 01:30:18,789 - And then Moses himself showed up. 1881 01:30:18,933 --> 01:30:20,798 - Right here in the city of Flint? 1882 01:30:20,935 --> 01:30:22,800 - Right here in Flint. 1883 01:30:22,937 --> 01:30:24,837 - Were there people that wanted you to try this child, 1884 01:30:24,939 --> 01:30:26,907 Arthur Busch County Prosecutor, Flint, Michigan 1885 01:30:27,041 --> 01:30:30,067 or even try him as an adult? - Oh... Oh, yeah. 1886 01:30:30,211 --> 01:30:34,079 There were people from all over America that wrote and called 1887 01:30:34,215 --> 01:30:38,584 and sent mail and... It was amazing to me, um... 1888 01:30:38,719 --> 01:30:41,586 groups that were affiliated with the NRA - 1889 01:30:41,722 --> 01:30:45,590 groups, you know, people that I call "gun nuts" - 1890 01:30:45,726 --> 01:30:48,593 writing me and telling me what a horrible thing it was 1891 01:30:48,729 --> 01:30:53,098 that I had admonished homeowners in our country 1892 01:30:53,234 --> 01:30:57,102 to be careful about bringing weapons into their home. 1893 01:30:57,238 --> 01:31:00,605 They wanted this little boy hung from the highest tree. 1894 01:31:00,741 --> 01:31:03,608 I mean, there was such an undercurrent of racism 1895 01:31:03,744 --> 01:31:06,212 and hate and anger. 1896 01:31:06,314 --> 01:31:08,043 It was ugly. 1897 01:31:10,451 --> 01:31:11,975 - That's a picture that the little boy that was involved 1898 01:31:12,186 --> 01:31:13,448 in the Buell-school shooting... 1899 01:31:13,587 --> 01:31:15,612 Once he was brought back here to our office, 1900 01:31:15,756 --> 01:31:18,122 about 15 minutes after the shooting took place, 1901 01:31:18,259 --> 01:31:20,727 I gave him some crayons to kind of occupy him a little bit. 1902 01:31:20,795 --> 01:31:22,729 Michael Caldwell Police Detective 1903 01:31:22,797 --> 01:31:24,697 He came over and drew that picture for me. 1904 01:31:24,765 --> 01:31:26,892 Because at the time, I had pictures right behind my desk 1905 01:31:27,034 --> 01:31:29,901 that my children had drew for me and he wanted to draw me one. 1906 01:31:30,037 --> 01:31:33,438 - This is what he drew for you. What did he say this was? 1907 01:31:33,574 --> 01:31:34,768 - That's him at his house. 1908 01:31:34,909 --> 01:31:36,706 - That's him at his house, right here. 1909 01:31:36,844 --> 01:31:41,076 And why did you decide to hang on to it? 1910 01:31:41,215 --> 01:31:44,082 - Because of the gravity of the situation and what had occurred 1911 01:31:44,218 --> 01:31:46,584 and he asked me to hang that behind my desk, 1912 01:31:46,721 --> 01:31:49,622 so I put it in a frame and that's where it'll stay. 1913 01:31:51,726 --> 01:31:55,093 - Tamarla Owens was the mother of the six-year-old boy. 1914 01:31:55,229 --> 01:31:56,628 In order to get food stamps and health care for her children, 1915 01:31:59,934 --> 01:32:02,095 Tamarla was forced to work as part of the state of Michigan's 1916 01:32:02,236 --> 01:32:04,568 Welfare-to-Work Program. 1917 01:32:04,705 --> 01:32:06,764 This program was so successful 1918 01:32:06,907 --> 01:32:08,602 in tossing poor people off welfare 1919 01:32:08,743 --> 01:32:10,176 that it's founder, 1920 01:32:10,311 --> 01:32:12,176 Gerald Miller, was soon hired 1921 01:32:12,313 --> 01:32:15,339 by the number-one firm in the country that states turned to 1922 01:32:15,483 --> 01:32:19,783 to privatize their welfare systems. 1923 01:32:19,920 --> 01:32:23,686 That firm was Lockheed Martin. With the cold war over 1924 01:32:23,824 --> 01:32:26,292 and no enemy left to frighten the public, 1925 01:32:26,427 --> 01:32:28,292 Lockheed had found the perfect way to diversify 1926 01:32:28,429 --> 01:32:30,056 and the perfect way 1927 01:32:30,197 --> 01:32:32,062 to profit from people's fears, 1928 01:32:32,199 --> 01:32:34,064 with an enemy much closer to home: 1929 01:32:34,201 --> 01:32:36,601 poor black mothers 1930 01:32:36,737 --> 01:32:38,398 like Tamarla Owens. 1931 01:32:38,539 --> 01:32:41,508 - We've got a one-parent family and the mother's travelling 60 miles. 1932 01:32:41,609 --> 01:32:44,169 Sheriff Robert Pickell Flint, Michigan 1933 01:32:44,278 --> 01:32:46,473 An hour, an hour and a half away to go to work 1934 01:32:46,547 --> 01:32:48,538 an hour, an hour and a half to come home. 1935 01:32:48,616 --> 01:32:50,914 How does that help a community? But that's part of the state... 1936 01:32:51,052 --> 01:32:52,952 you know, making parents responsible, making them work-- 1937 01:32:53,087 --> 01:32:54,987 - Welfare to work. - Welfare to work. 1938 01:32:55,122 --> 01:32:57,113 That's a program that ought to be stopped 1939 01:32:57,258 --> 01:32:59,123 because it really has no merit. 1940 01:32:59,260 --> 01:33:01,125 I think it adds more to the problem 1941 01:33:01,262 --> 01:33:03,127 than it does to solve it. 1942 01:33:03,264 --> 01:33:05,095 - Really? - I do. 1943 01:33:05,232 --> 01:33:07,097 - You're the sheriff and you feel this way. 1944 01:33:07,234 --> 01:33:11,102 - I do, I do. I wish I could put two parents in every home 1945 01:33:11,238 --> 01:33:12,796 and make every parent equally responsible, 1946 01:33:12,940 --> 01:33:14,237 but I can't do that. 1947 01:33:14,375 --> 01:33:16,240 But we're not doing anything by taking one parent 1948 01:33:16,377 --> 01:33:19,244 and putting them on a bus and sending them out of town 1949 01:33:19,380 --> 01:33:21,871 to make $5.50 an hour. 1950 01:33:22,016 --> 01:33:24,814 - This is the bus that she was forced to ride every day 1951 01:33:24,952 --> 01:33:26,817 in order to work off the welfare money 1952 01:33:26,954 --> 01:33:28,854 the state had given her. 1953 01:33:32,193 --> 01:33:34,559 She, and many others from Flint who were poor, 1954 01:33:34,695 --> 01:33:37,562 would make the 80-mile round-trip journey every day, 1955 01:33:37,698 --> 01:33:40,258 from Flint to Auburn Hills, in Oakland County, 1956 01:33:40,401 --> 01:33:44,770 one of the wealthiest areas in the country. 1957 01:33:44,905 --> 01:33:46,770 Tamarla would leave 1958 01:33:46,907 --> 01:33:50,343 early in the morning and return late at night, 1959 01:33:50,478 --> 01:33:53,845 rarely seeing her young children. 1960 01:33:53,981 --> 01:33:57,075 - What's the point in doing that? Where does the state benefit? 1961 01:33:57,218 --> 01:33:59,584 Where does Flint and Genesee County benefit from that? 1962 01:33:59,720 --> 01:34:02,587 We have a child dead. I think that may be, in part, 1963 01:34:02,723 --> 01:34:04,588 part of the problem. 1964 01:34:04,725 --> 01:34:08,092 We drove the one parent out. 1965 01:34:08,229 --> 01:34:12,097 Now, you or anybody else that can tell me 1966 01:34:12,233 --> 01:34:15,100 that that best serves the community, 1967 01:34:15,236 --> 01:34:17,932 I shake my head and wonder why. 1968 01:34:18,072 --> 01:34:20,666 - How long you been riding the bus? 1969 01:34:20,808 --> 01:34:22,241 - I've been working here 1970 01:34:22,376 --> 01:34:24,537 just about three years now. - About three years? 1971 01:34:24,678 --> 01:34:28,045 - Yeah. My brother... I got my brother working here, 1972 01:34:28,182 --> 01:34:30,047 half of my neighbourhood works out here. 1973 01:34:30,184 --> 01:34:33,642 Just about everybody I know personally works in the mall. 1974 01:34:33,787 --> 01:34:36,551 In Flint, doing the same thing I'm doing now, 1975 01:34:36,690 --> 01:34:39,557 they only pay minimum wage in Flint. I come 40 miles 1976 01:34:39,693 --> 01:34:42,059 to make three or four dollars more an hour. 1977 01:34:42,196 --> 01:34:45,063 - How much do you make an hour? - I make 8.50 now. 1978 01:34:45,199 --> 01:34:47,064 - Is that enough to pay the bills? 1979 01:34:47,201 --> 01:34:48,600 - No. 1980 01:34:48,736 --> 01:34:50,829 - So did you know Tamarla Owens, 1981 01:34:50,971 --> 01:34:53,872 the woman whose son shot the little girl? 1982 01:34:54,008 --> 01:34:56,568 I think she rode this bus. - I knew her a little bit. 1983 01:34:56,710 --> 01:34:59,076 Not real good. - Nice lady? 1984 01:34:59,213 --> 01:35:02,580 - Yeah, she was okay. She came to work every day, did her job. 1985 01:35:02,716 --> 01:35:05,082 She worked two jobs, so... - She worked two jobs? 1986 01:35:05,219 --> 01:35:07,779 - She was trying to make ends meet. 1987 01:35:07,922 --> 01:35:09,787 "We're going hopping We're going hopping today 1988 01:35:09,924 --> 01:35:11,585 "Where things are popping... 1989 01:35:11,725 --> 01:35:13,852 - This is Dick Clark's American Bandstand Grill, 1990 01:35:13,994 --> 01:35:16,963 where Tamarla worked one of her two jobs. 1991 01:35:17,097 --> 01:35:18,962 "On the Bandstand Bandstand" 1992 01:35:19,099 --> 01:35:22,591 - I think she worked in this room here, as a bartender, 1993 01:35:22,736 --> 01:35:26,536 fountain-person making drinks, making shakes, desserts. 1994 01:35:26,674 --> 01:35:29,302 - Was she a good employee? - Yeah, she was. 1995 01:35:29,443 --> 01:35:32,412 She also worked at the Fudgery, in the mall here. 1996 01:35:35,249 --> 01:35:37,717 - Dick Clark is an American icon, 1997 01:35:37,851 --> 01:35:40,911 the man who brought rock'n'roll into our homes every week 1998 01:35:41,055 --> 01:35:41,953 on American Bandstand. 1999 01:35:42,089 --> 01:35:44,455 - Every part of your life, you can link up 2000 01:35:44,592 --> 01:35:46,492 to a part of music, usually. So, as Dick says, 2001 01:35:46,627 --> 01:35:48,561 "It's the soundtrack of our lives." 2002 01:35:48,696 --> 01:35:51,756 Music's the soundtrack of our lives. 2003 01:35:51,899 --> 01:35:54,060 - His restaurant and the Fudgery, here in Auburn Hills, 2004 01:35:54,201 --> 01:35:56,897 applied for special tax breaks because they were using 2005 01:35:57,037 --> 01:35:58,902 welfare people as employees. 2006 01:35:59,039 --> 01:36:01,234 Even though Tamarla worked up to 70 hours a week 2007 01:36:01,375 --> 01:36:03,240 at these two jobs 2008 01:36:03,377 --> 01:36:06,904 in the mall, she did not earn enough to pay her rent. 2009 01:36:07,047 --> 01:36:08,912 And one week before the shooting, 2010 01:36:09,049 --> 01:36:10,812 was told by her landlord 2011 01:36:10,951 --> 01:36:12,816 that he was evicting her. 2012 01:36:12,953 --> 01:36:15,444 With nowhere to go and not wanting to take 2013 01:36:15,589 --> 01:36:19,116 her two children out of school, Tamarla asked her brother 2014 01:36:19,260 --> 01:36:21,660 if they could stay with him for a few weeks. 2015 01:36:21,795 --> 01:36:23,592 It was there that Tamarla's son 2016 01:36:23,731 --> 01:36:28,498 found a small 32-calibre gun and took it to school. 2017 01:36:28,636 --> 01:36:31,036 Tamarla did not see him take the gun to school, 2018 01:36:31,171 --> 01:36:34,038 because she was on a state bus to go serve drinks 2019 01:36:34,174 --> 01:36:36,540 and make fudge for rich people. 2020 01:36:36,677 --> 01:36:39,305 "Bandstand" 2021 01:36:42,449 --> 01:36:44,314 I decided to fly out to California 2022 01:36:44,451 --> 01:36:47,249 to ask Dick Clark what he thought about a system 2023 01:36:47,388 --> 01:36:49,686 that forces poor, single mothers to work 2024 01:36:49,823 --> 01:36:52,053 two low-wage jobs to survive. 2025 01:36:52,192 --> 01:36:56,060 I'm doing a documentary on these school shootings 2026 01:36:56,196 --> 01:36:58,061 and, you know, guns and all that. 2027 01:36:58,198 --> 01:37:02,066 And in my hometown of Flint Michigan, which you know, 2028 01:37:02,202 --> 01:37:04,568 this little six-year-old shot a six-year-old-- 2029 01:37:04,705 --> 01:37:07,572 - Get in the car, Dave! Watch your arm, watch your arm. 2030 01:37:07,708 --> 01:37:10,575 - Oop, sorry, sorry. - I'm sorry, we're really late. 2031 01:37:10,711 --> 01:37:13,578 - Anyways, but the mother of the kid who did the shooting 2032 01:37:13,714 --> 01:37:16,080 works at Dick Clark's All-American Grill... 2033 01:37:16,216 --> 01:37:18,081 - Forget it. - ...in Oakland County... 2034 01:37:18,218 --> 01:37:20,083 - Close the door. - A Welfare-to-work program-- 2035 01:37:20,220 --> 01:37:22,085 - Close the door. - These people are forced... 2036 01:37:22,222 --> 01:37:24,019 Dick, no... - Bye-bye. Come on, move over! 2037 01:37:24,158 --> 01:37:27,025 - I want you to help me convince the governor of Michigan... 2038 01:37:27,161 --> 01:37:30,028 It's a Welfare-to-work pro... These women are forced to work! 2039 01:37:30,164 --> 01:37:32,029 They've got kids at home. Dick! 2040 01:37:32,166 --> 01:37:33,793 Ah, jeez! 2041 01:37:33,934 --> 01:37:36,528 In George Bush's America, 2042 01:37:36,670 --> 01:37:39,400 the poor were not a priority. 2043 01:37:39,540 --> 01:37:42,236 And after September 11th, 2001, 2044 01:37:42,376 --> 01:37:44,844 correcting America's social problems 2045 01:37:44,978 --> 01:37:46,878 took a back seat to fear, 2046 01:37:47,014 --> 01:37:49,744 panic and a new set of priorities. 2047 01:37:49,883 --> 01:37:52,545 - One way to express our unity 2048 01:37:52,686 --> 01:37:56,554 is for Congress to set the military budget, 2049 01:37:56,690 --> 01:37:58,555 the defence of the United States, 2050 01:37:58,692 --> 01:38:02,526 as the number-one priority and fully fund my request! 2051 01:38:07,201 --> 01:38:09,294 - We've been selling a lot of chemical suits, 2052 01:38:09,436 --> 01:38:12,064 with the gloves and the hoods. 2053 01:38:12,206 --> 01:38:14,367 And we've been selling a lot of gas masks. 2054 01:38:14,508 --> 01:38:16,703 - I'm trying to get one for myself and my puppy. 2055 01:38:16,844 --> 01:38:18,607 [female reporter]: Denis Marks and his wife 2056 01:38:18,746 --> 01:38:19,906 have been stocking up supplies. 2057 01:38:20,047 --> 01:38:22,106 - Weapons, ammunition... 2058 01:38:22,249 --> 01:38:24,046 [ male reporter]: Wal-Mart says after September 11th, 2059 01:38:24,184 --> 01:38:26,516 gun sales surged 70%, 2060 01:38:26,653 --> 01:38:28,746 ammunition up 140%. 2061 01:38:28,889 --> 01:38:30,880 In Dallas, they're already taking potshots 2062 01:38:31,024 --> 01:38:32,889 at Osama bin Laden. 2063 01:38:33,026 --> 01:38:34,891 - In the months following the 9/11 attacks, 2064 01:38:35,028 --> 01:38:38,725 we, Americans, were gripped in a state of fear. 2065 01:38:38,866 --> 01:38:40,800 None of us knew if we too would die 2066 01:38:40,934 --> 01:38:43,300 at the hands of the evildoers, 2067 01:38:43,437 --> 01:38:44,927 or who might be sitting 2068 01:38:45,072 --> 01:38:47,905 next to some crazy guy trying to light his shoes on fire. 2069 01:38:48,041 --> 01:38:49,599 The threat seemed very real. 2070 01:38:49,743 --> 01:38:53,042 - Sounds a little paranoid but I'm not gonna take the chance. 2071 01:38:53,180 --> 01:38:55,148 Just trying to protect myself and my family. 2072 01:38:55,282 --> 01:38:57,182 - Our growing fears were turned 2073 01:38:57,317 --> 01:38:59,285 into a handsome profit for many. 2074 01:38:59,420 --> 01:39:00,819 - Mike Blake has seen 2075 01:39:00,954 --> 01:39:02,979 a 30% increase in sales at ADT 2076 01:39:03,123 --> 01:39:04,249 over the last month. 2077 01:39:04,391 --> 01:39:07,121 Most of the people he talks to are still a little uneasy 2078 01:39:07,261 --> 01:39:09,422 over the September 11th terrorist attacks. 2079 01:39:09,563 --> 01:39:11,827 - How are we afraid of all these things, it's because 2080 01:39:11,965 --> 01:39:14,957 a lot of people are making a lot of money off of it 2081 01:39:15,102 --> 01:39:17,093 and a lot of careers off of it. 2082 01:39:17,237 --> 01:39:19,262 And so, there's vested interests, 2083 01:39:19,406 --> 01:39:21,772 a lot of activity to keep us afraid. 2084 01:39:21,909 --> 01:39:24,571 - And what better way to fight box-cutter-wielding terrorists 2085 01:39:24,711 --> 01:39:27,077 than to order a record number of fighter jets 2086 01:39:27,214 --> 01:39:29,011 from Lockheed? 2087 01:39:29,149 --> 01:39:31,947 Yes, everyone felt safer, especially with the army 2088 01:39:32,085 --> 01:39:34,178 doing garbage detail on Park Avenue. 2089 01:39:34,321 --> 01:39:36,414 And the greatest benefit of all of a terrorized public 2090 01:39:36,557 --> 01:39:38,582 is that the corporate 2091 01:39:38,725 --> 01:39:43,594 and political leaders can get away with just about anything. 2092 01:39:43,730 --> 01:39:45,595 - I've never seen a better example 2093 01:39:45,732 --> 01:39:47,597 of cash-and-carry government 2094 01:39:47,734 --> 01:39:52,194 than this Bush administration and Enron. 2095 01:39:52,339 --> 01:39:54,204 - There were a lot of things that I didn't know 2096 01:39:54,341 --> 01:39:56,206 after the World Trade Center attack, 2097 01:39:56,343 --> 01:40:00,541 but one thing was clear: whether it was before or after 2098 01:40:00,681 --> 01:40:04,447 September 11th, a public that's this out of control with fear 2099 01:40:04,585 --> 01:40:07,145 should not have a lot of guns or ammo laying around. 2100 01:40:09,256 --> 01:40:13,625 - Well, I was shot with a Tech-9. 2101 01:40:13,760 --> 01:40:15,625 - Nine millimetre? 2102 01:40:15,762 --> 01:40:17,662 - Yeah. Yeah, I was, uh... 2103 01:40:19,766 --> 01:40:21,631 I guess it was supposed to be semi-automatic, 2104 01:40:21,768 --> 01:40:24,066 but it kind of seemed like fully automatic to me, 2105 01:40:24,204 --> 01:40:27,401 from what I remember. - This is Richard Costaldo. 2106 01:40:27,541 --> 01:40:31,568 And this is Mark Taylor. Both of these boys were shot 2107 01:40:31,712 --> 01:40:33,907 the day of the Columbine massacre. 2108 01:40:34,047 --> 01:40:38,108 Richard is paralyzed for life and in a wheelchair. 2109 01:40:38,252 --> 01:40:42,086 And Mark is barely standing after numerous operations. 2110 01:40:42,222 --> 01:40:44,588 - The kids at Columbine had to pay a penalty. 2111 01:40:44,725 --> 01:40:46,750 We paid a penalty that day... for this nation. 2112 01:40:46,894 --> 01:40:48,759 The way we look at it. 2113 01:40:48,896 --> 01:40:51,763 - Mark and Richard were disabled and suffering 2114 01:40:51,899 --> 01:40:56,268 from the 17-cent K-Mart bullets still embedded in their bodies. 2115 01:40:56,403 --> 01:40:59,634 As they showed me the various entry points for the bullets, 2116 01:40:59,773 --> 01:41:02,105 I thought of one way we could reduce 2117 01:41:02,242 --> 01:41:06,269 the number of guns and bullets laying around. I asked the boys 2118 01:41:06,413 --> 01:41:10,281 if they'd like to go to K-Mart to return the merchandise. 2119 01:41:13,253 --> 01:41:15,517 - Ready? - You... you go. 2120 01:41:34,074 --> 01:41:38,033 K-Mart Headquarters Troy, Michigan 2121 01:41:52,893 --> 01:41:54,258 - Hi. 2122 01:41:54,394 --> 01:41:56,259 - Excuse me, will you turn the camera off, please? 2123 01:41:56,396 --> 01:41:59,263 - We're here to see Mr. Conaway. - You have to turn the camera off 2124 01:41:59,399 --> 01:42:02,197 while you're in the building. - Oh, okay, all right. 2125 01:42:02,269 --> 01:42:04,032 Okay, turn it off now. 2126 01:42:04,938 --> 01:42:07,202 [ One hour later] - Hey, Michael. - Hi, how are you? 2127 01:42:07,274 --> 01:42:09,765 - I'm Mary Lorenz. I'm director of Media Relations for K-Mart. 2128 01:42:09,910 --> 01:42:12,105 - Oh, good. All right, good. - How can I help you today? 2129 01:42:12,245 --> 01:42:15,112 - Well, I'm here today... This is Richard Costaldo. 2130 01:42:15,248 --> 01:42:17,614 - Richard, nice to meet you. - And this is Mark Taylor. 2131 01:42:17,751 --> 01:42:20,117 - Mark. - And they're students 2132 01:42:20,253 --> 01:42:24,053 from Columbine High School. They were shot at Columbine, 2133 01:42:24,191 --> 01:42:27,183 in the massacre, with bullets from K-Mart. 2134 01:42:27,327 --> 01:42:30,023 - You came a long way. All the way from Colorado. 2135 01:42:30,163 --> 01:42:34,065 - Yeah, I just... I was thinking that... 2136 01:42:34,201 --> 01:42:36,066 since you stopped selling the handguns and all, 2137 01:42:36,203 --> 01:42:40,071 it'd kind of make sense to stop selling the bullets too. 2138 01:42:40,207 --> 01:42:43,074 - Our request is that you get rid of nine-millimetre bullets 2139 01:42:43,210 --> 01:42:45,405 and that you don't sell them in the store completely. 2140 01:42:45,545 --> 01:42:48,070 - We do carry... You probably are aware of K-Mart - 2141 01:42:48,215 --> 01:42:50,581 hopefully, you're shoppers at our stores - 2142 01:42:50,717 --> 01:42:54,585 that we do only carry, you know, sporting firearms 2143 01:42:54,721 --> 01:42:59,590 and the accessories that go with the hunting sport. 2144 01:42:59,726 --> 01:43:03,093 And we'll certainly take your message to our chairman and CEO, 2145 01:43:03,230 --> 01:43:05,494 Chuck Conaway. He's not here today. 2146 01:43:05,632 --> 01:43:08,192 - He's not here today? - No. He's not here, actually, 2147 01:43:08,335 --> 01:43:10,895 this whole week. - Not at all during the week? 2148 01:43:11,038 --> 01:43:13,905 Do you have a limit on the number of bullets, ammunition, 2149 01:43:14,041 --> 01:43:15,906 that people can purchase? - You know, I can't answer 2150 01:43:16,043 --> 01:43:18,102 these questions for you. I'm not the merchandiser 2151 01:43:18,245 --> 01:43:19,644 who places those products in our stores. 2152 01:43:19,780 --> 01:43:20,974 - Can we speak to that person? 2153 01:43:21,114 --> 01:43:23,173 - But I can get answers to those questions for you. 2154 01:43:23,316 --> 01:43:25,807 If you leave your card, I could get those answers for you. 2155 01:43:25,952 --> 01:43:27,419 - We don't want to leave a card. 2156 01:43:27,554 --> 01:43:29,715 The reason why we can't take a card 2157 01:43:29,856 --> 01:43:31,756 and come back is because Mark here, 2158 01:43:31,892 --> 01:43:34,759 he's got a K-Mart bullet just an inch away... right? 2159 01:43:34,895 --> 01:43:36,760 - Yeah. - From your aorta. 2160 01:43:36,897 --> 01:43:40,128 - In between my aorta and spine. - Between your aorta and spine. 2161 01:43:40,267 --> 01:43:42,963 - I'm glad to see that you're still able to stand. 2162 01:43:43,103 --> 01:43:45,571 - And I told him that somebody here would listen, 2163 01:43:45,706 --> 01:43:48,072 somebody here would... would... 2164 01:43:48,208 --> 01:43:52,076 would take the request seriously. Not just a PR person, 2165 01:43:52,212 --> 01:43:54,077 but somebody who has some authority and can answer 2166 01:43:54,214 --> 01:43:56,648 some of the questions that they want answered. 2167 01:43:56,783 --> 01:43:58,648 - K-Mart does care about this, 2168 01:43:58,785 --> 01:44:00,650 but I can't go any further right now. 2169 01:44:00,787 --> 01:44:02,652 So until I make a call, um, 2170 01:44:02,789 --> 01:44:05,280 I'm gonna go back to the office 2171 01:44:05,425 --> 01:44:07,950 and see if there's anyone in merchandising... 2172 01:44:08,095 --> 01:44:11,394 - Mary went back upstairs. And two hours later, 2173 01:44:11,531 --> 01:44:14,398 she brought down this guy whose job it is to buy the bullets 2174 01:44:14,534 --> 01:44:15,899 for K-Mart. 2175 01:44:16,036 --> 01:44:18,596 - Good. Stay out of trouble. - Yes. 2176 01:44:18,739 --> 01:44:20,900 - We're not the ones in trouble, guys. 2177 01:44:21,041 --> 01:44:23,100 Mark thought he'd show him his bullet wounds. 2178 01:44:23,243 --> 01:44:25,040 Those are his bullet holes. - Hm. 2179 01:44:25,178 --> 01:44:27,043 - From your bullets. 2180 01:44:27,180 --> 01:44:29,808 That's where the K-Mart bullets went in. 2181 01:44:29,950 --> 01:44:31,815 - Well, take care. 2182 01:44:31,952 --> 01:44:34,546 - Is anybody else gonna come down? 2183 01:44:34,688 --> 01:44:36,553 Is anybody else gonna come down? Is that it? 2184 01:44:36,690 --> 01:44:38,920 - I'll check. - Okay, thank you. 2185 01:44:39,059 --> 01:44:41,550 We waited around a couple more hours 2186 01:44:41,695 --> 01:44:43,822 but no one else came down. 2187 01:44:43,964 --> 01:44:46,933 As we left the building, Mark came up with an idea. 2188 01:44:47,067 --> 01:44:48,932 He suggested that we go 2189 01:44:49,069 --> 01:44:53,836 to the nearest K-Mart and buy out all their bullets. 2190 01:44:53,974 --> 01:44:56,772 - Just take as many of those as you can. 2191 01:44:56,910 --> 01:44:59,276 - Yeah, you can come around here and look. 2192 01:44:59,412 --> 01:45:02,006 - What else do we have over here? 2193 01:45:02,149 --> 01:45:05,016 You got 357. Sure, I'll take 'em all, take everything you got. 2194 01:45:05,152 --> 01:45:07,586 - So you're 17? You're what? - Sixteen. 2195 01:45:07,721 --> 01:45:09,086 - Wait. 2196 01:45:09,222 --> 01:45:11,087 - Oh, shit! 2197 01:45:11,224 --> 01:45:13,522 - Oh, my God... 2198 01:45:13,660 --> 01:45:16,595 - Mark pretty much cleaned them out of their ammunition. 2199 01:45:16,730 --> 01:45:19,961 And the next day, we decided to go back to K-Mart headquarters 2200 01:45:20,100 --> 01:45:22,125 with all the bullets. This time, 2201 01:45:22,302 --> 01:45:23,792 we brought the press. 2202 01:45:24,004 --> 01:45:25,335 - Our local first coverage of south-eastern Michigan 2203 01:45:25,505 --> 01:45:27,029 continues now with all-new stories. 2204 01:45:29,943 --> 01:45:31,968 - Coming up here on our six-o'clock report, 2205 01:45:32,112 --> 01:45:33,841 a warning to everyone this summer to watch out for snakes. 2206 01:45:33,947 --> 01:45:36,916 You'll hear from a mom who was bitten by a rattlesnake. 2207 01:45:37,050 --> 01:45:38,915 - And also, students who survived the Columbine massacre 2208 01:45:39,052 --> 01:45:42,544 are in town. They are very angry with K-Mart. 2209 01:45:42,689 --> 01:45:45,658 - We're here to see Chuck Conaway, the chairman of K-Mart. 2210 01:45:45,792 --> 01:45:47,555 - How you doing, sir? It's always a pleasure. 2211 01:45:47,694 --> 01:45:51,061 Okay, uh... 2212 01:45:51,198 --> 01:45:54,099 They would like to speak to Mr. Conaway. 2213 01:45:54,234 --> 01:45:58,000 - Here's the nine-millimetres. 2214 01:45:58,138 --> 01:46:00,663 These are the bullets that are in both Richard 2215 01:46:00,807 --> 01:46:03,105 and in Mark's body right now. 2216 01:46:10,650 --> 01:46:11,674 - Move your group outside. 2217 01:46:11,818 --> 01:46:13,718 I'll have somebody here in five minutes. 2218 01:46:13,854 --> 01:46:15,378 - Do me a favour, don't block the door. 2219 01:46:15,522 --> 01:46:17,046 Just off to the side, if you would. 2220 01:46:17,190 --> 01:46:18,748 - Will go outside and somebody will come out. 2221 01:46:18,892 --> 01:46:19,950 - My name's Laurie McTavish. 2222 01:46:20,093 --> 01:46:22,653 I'm the Vice-president of Communications for K-Mart. 2223 01:46:22,796 --> 01:46:26,027 I'm happy to deliver a statement on behalf of the company. 2224 01:46:26,166 --> 01:46:29,533 What happened in Columbine, Colorado, was truly tragic 2225 01:46:29,669 --> 01:46:31,534 and touched every American. 2226 01:46:31,671 --> 01:46:34,037 We're sorry for the... 2227 01:46:34,174 --> 01:46:36,233 disadvantage to this young man. 2228 01:46:36,376 --> 01:46:39,038 K-Mart is phasing out the sale of handgun ammunition. 2229 01:46:39,179 --> 01:46:42,478 The business plan calls for this to be complete 2230 01:46:42,616 --> 01:46:46,552 in the continental U.S. within the next 90 days. 2231 01:46:46,686 --> 01:46:48,051 - Wow! Wow! 2232 01:46:48,188 --> 01:46:50,053 - K-Mart representatives met with Mr. Moore 2233 01:46:50,190 --> 01:46:52,556 and the students from Columbine, Colorado, yesterday, 2234 01:46:52,692 --> 01:46:55,559 and listened to their concerns about the product 2235 01:46:55,695 --> 01:46:57,560 carried in K-Mart stores. 2236 01:46:57,697 --> 01:47:00,564 The company committed, at the end of that meeting, 2237 01:47:00,700 --> 01:47:04,431 that K-Mart would have an answer for them within a week's time. 2238 01:47:04,571 --> 01:47:07,438 - Well, the first thing we want to do is thank you 2239 01:47:07,574 --> 01:47:11,066 for committing to no longer selling handgun ammunition 2240 01:47:11,211 --> 01:47:13,076 in your stores. And within 90 days-- 2241 01:47:13,213 --> 01:47:15,579 - The process will be phased out within 90 days. 2242 01:47:15,715 --> 01:47:18,081 - And after 90 days, there will be no more selling 2243 01:47:18,218 --> 01:47:21,085 of ammunition that can go into handguns or assault weapons. 2244 01:47:21,221 --> 01:47:23,416 - Firearm ammunition, will be... We will not sell it, 2245 01:47:23,556 --> 01:47:25,421 after 90 days, in our stores. 2246 01:47:25,558 --> 01:47:28,356 - We greatly appreciate that. - Thank you. 2247 01:47:28,495 --> 01:47:30,554 - Thank you very much. Thank you. That's very brave. 2248 01:47:33,667 --> 01:47:35,328 Thank you. Wow! 2249 01:47:35,468 --> 01:47:38,699 That blows my mind. That's more than what we asked for. 2250 01:47:38,838 --> 01:47:41,534 - It's remarkable. - Yeah. Well, like I told you-- 2251 01:47:41,675 --> 01:47:43,540 - I didn't think-- - Did you think? 2252 01:47:43,677 --> 01:47:45,542 - No! - We're like, uh... 2253 01:47:45,679 --> 01:47:49,775 We're just getting ready to... We're going to the airport. 2254 01:47:49,916 --> 01:47:52,544 The kids from Columbine had scored an overwhelming victory 2255 01:47:52,686 --> 01:47:54,551 against K-Mart and it inspired me 2256 01:47:54,688 --> 01:47:58,784 to do something that I knew I had to do. 2257 01:47:58,925 --> 01:48:01,485 All I needed... was a star map. 2258 01:48:06,700 --> 01:48:09,066 [ ringing gate bell ] 2259 01:48:09,202 --> 01:48:11,102 [ phone ringing ] 2260 01:48:22,215 --> 01:48:24,012 - Hello? - Mr. Heston? 2261 01:48:24,150 --> 01:48:26,015 - Yeah. - This is Michael Moore. 2262 01:48:26,152 --> 01:48:27,517 - Yes. - The film-maker? 2263 01:48:27,654 --> 01:48:29,519 - Yes, of course. - Yes. How you doing? 2264 01:48:29,656 --> 01:48:31,021 - Fine, thank you. 2265 01:48:31,157 --> 01:48:34,024 - Listen, I was wondering if maybe I could talk to you. 2266 01:48:34,160 --> 01:48:37,857 We're making a documentary about the whole gun issue. 2267 01:48:37,998 --> 01:48:39,863 And I'm a member of the NRA. 2268 01:48:40,000 --> 01:48:42,525 I thought maybe we could talk a little bit about-- 2269 01:48:42,669 --> 01:48:44,534 - Tell you what, let me look at my calendar. 2270 01:48:44,671 --> 01:48:47,037 I may be able to give you some time tomorrow. 2271 01:48:47,173 --> 01:48:50,040 I have some people here now. - Okay, well, how can I-- 2272 01:48:50,176 --> 01:48:51,541 Pardon me? - Hold the phone. 2273 01:48:51,678 --> 01:48:53,270 - Okay, thank you. - Okay. 2274 01:48:53,413 --> 01:48:56,041 I can give you a little time tomorrow morning. 2275 01:48:56,182 --> 01:48:58,047 I think that's Thursday. - Yes. 2276 01:48:58,184 --> 01:49:00,550 - Let's say 8:30. - Eight-thirty in the morning? 2277 01:49:00,687 --> 01:49:02,552 - Yeah. Okay? - Okay. And just come here? 2278 01:49:02,689 --> 01:49:05,351 - Yes. - Okay, good. 2279 01:49:08,661 --> 01:49:10,561 [ phone ringing ] - Hello? 2280 01:49:10,697 --> 01:49:13,063 - Hi. It's Michael Moore here to see Charlton Heston. 2281 01:49:13,199 --> 01:49:15,099 - Okay. [ beeping ] 2282 01:49:19,205 --> 01:49:21,105 [ theme music from "Mr. Roger's Neighborhood" ] 2283 01:49:34,721 --> 01:49:37,121 - Hi. Good morning. 2284 01:49:42,228 --> 01:49:44,594 How are you? - Fine. 2285 01:49:44,731 --> 01:49:46,995 - Thank you very much for agreeing to see me. 2286 01:49:55,241 --> 01:49:57,607 He took me out to his pool-and-tennis house 2287 01:49:57,744 --> 01:49:59,609 so we could have a chat. 2288 01:49:59,746 --> 01:50:02,681 I told him that I was a lifetime member of the NRA 2289 01:50:02,816 --> 01:50:04,943 and showed him my membership card. 2290 01:50:05,085 --> 01:50:06,882 - Good for you. Well done. 2291 01:50:07,020 --> 01:50:08,885 - I assume you have guns in the house here? 2292 01:50:09,022 --> 01:50:12,116 - Indeed I do. Bad guys take notice! 2293 01:50:12,258 --> 01:50:14,123 - So you have them for protection? 2294 01:50:14,260 --> 01:50:16,125 - Yeah. Sure. - Have you ever been 2295 01:50:16,262 --> 01:50:18,127 a victim of crime? - No. No. 2296 01:50:18,264 --> 01:50:22,030 - Never been assaulted or...? - No. 2297 01:50:22,168 --> 01:50:24,966 - No violence toward you, but you have guns in the house. 2298 01:50:25,105 --> 01:50:27,073 - Loaded. - They're loaded? 2299 01:50:27,207 --> 01:50:29,573 - Well, if you really needed a weapon for self-defence, 2300 01:50:29,709 --> 01:50:31,574 you need it loaded. - Okay, but why... 2301 01:50:31,711 --> 01:50:33,576 why do you need it for self-defence? Because-- 2302 01:50:33,713 --> 01:50:35,578 - I don't. - Yeah, you've never been 2303 01:50:35,715 --> 01:50:37,580 a victim of crime, you haven't been assaulted. 2304 01:50:37,717 --> 01:50:39,582 - No, that's true. - You haven't been, you know... 2305 01:50:39,719 --> 01:50:43,086 Why would you... So why not... Why don't you unload the gun? 2306 01:50:43,223 --> 01:50:46,590 - Because the second amendment gives me the right 2307 01:50:46,726 --> 01:50:48,591 to have it loaded. - I agree. 2308 01:50:48,728 --> 01:50:51,094 I totally agree with that. I'm just saying... I mean, 2309 01:50:51,231 --> 01:50:52,596 the second amendment gives me-- 2310 01:50:52,732 --> 01:50:54,597 - Let's say it's a comfort factor. 2311 01:50:54,734 --> 01:50:57,601 - It gives you comfort to know that there's a loaded gun. 2312 01:50:57,737 --> 01:50:59,102 - Yeah. 2313 01:50:59,239 --> 01:51:02,106 - Comfort meaning that it allows you to relax and feel safe? 2314 01:51:02,242 --> 01:51:04,107 - Not worry about it. - Not worry, not be afraid. 2315 01:51:04,244 --> 01:51:06,041 - And I'm not really, but, uh... 2316 01:51:06,179 --> 01:51:10,616 I'm exercising one of the rights passed on down to me 2317 01:51:10,750 --> 01:51:13,617 from those wise, old, dead white guys that invented this country. 2318 01:51:13,753 --> 01:51:16,722 If it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me. 2319 01:51:16,856 --> 01:51:18,517 - But you could still exercise the right, 2320 01:51:18,658 --> 01:51:21,092 just by having a gun unloaded and locked away somewhere. 2321 01:51:21,227 --> 01:51:22,387 - I choose to have it. 2322 01:51:22,529 --> 01:51:25,054 - What sort of strikes me as interesting is that, 2323 01:51:25,198 --> 01:51:28,065 in other countries, where they don't have the murder rate, 2324 01:51:28,201 --> 01:51:30,066 the gun-murder rate that we have, that, uh... 2325 01:51:30,203 --> 01:51:32,068 many people say, 2326 01:51:32,205 --> 01:51:34,070 "Well, that's because they don't have guns around. 2327 01:51:34,207 --> 01:51:37,074 It's hard to get a gun in Britain or Germany or whatever." 2328 01:51:37,210 --> 01:51:41,078 But we went to Canada and there's seven million guns 2329 01:51:41,214 --> 01:51:43,205 in 10-million homes. - There won't be very long. 2330 01:51:43,349 --> 01:51:44,873 - But hear me out, though. - Okay. 2331 01:51:45,018 --> 01:51:46,576 - Canada is a nation of hunters, 2332 01:51:46,719 --> 01:51:48,584 millions of guns, 2333 01:51:48,721 --> 01:51:51,588 and yet, they had just a few murders last year. 2334 01:51:51,724 --> 01:51:53,589 That's it. A country of 30-million people. 2335 01:51:53,726 --> 01:51:56,593 Now, why - here's my question - why is it that... 2336 01:51:56,729 --> 01:51:58,720 that they've got all these guns laying around, 2337 01:51:58,865 --> 01:52:00,730 yet they don't kill each other 2338 01:52:00,867 --> 01:52:02,732 at the level that we kill each other? 2339 01:52:02,869 --> 01:52:05,099 - I think American history is... 2340 01:52:05,238 --> 01:52:07,604 uh... has a lot of blood 2341 01:52:07,740 --> 01:52:09,605 on its hands. - And Germany history doesn't? 2342 01:52:09,742 --> 01:52:11,607 - No. - And British history? 2343 01:52:11,744 --> 01:52:14,110 - I don't think as much. - Oh, are you... 2344 01:52:14,247 --> 01:52:16,613 Germans don't have as much, blood on their hands? 2345 01:52:16,749 --> 01:52:19,115 - Uh, they do, yes. - The Brits, they ruled the world 2346 01:52:19,252 --> 01:52:21,618 for 300 years at the barrel of a gun. 2347 01:52:21,754 --> 01:52:25,053 They're all violent people. They have bad guys, they have crime, 2348 01:52:25,191 --> 01:52:27,557 they have lots of guns-- 2349 01:52:27,694 --> 01:52:31,562 - Well, it's an interesting point, which can be explored 2350 01:52:31,698 --> 01:52:35,065 and you're good to explore it at great lengths, 2351 01:52:35,201 --> 01:52:38,068 but I think that's about all I have to say on it. 2352 01:52:38,204 --> 01:52:41,071 - You don't have any opinion, though, as to why that is, 2353 01:52:41,207 --> 01:52:43,072 that we are the unique country, the only country, 2354 01:52:43,209 --> 01:52:46,076 that does this, that kills each other on this level, with guns? 2355 01:52:46,212 --> 01:52:50,080 - Well, we have, probably, more mixed ethnicity 2356 01:52:50,216 --> 01:52:53,583 than other countries, some other countries. 2357 01:52:53,720 --> 01:52:55,585 - You think it's an ethnic thing? 2358 01:52:55,722 --> 01:52:57,587 - No, I don't. It's... 2359 01:52:57,724 --> 01:52:59,589 I wouldn't go so far as to say that. 2360 01:52:59,726 --> 01:53:03,093 We had enough problems with civil rights in the beginning. 2361 01:53:03,229 --> 01:53:07,097 It's... But, uh, I have no answer for that. 2362 01:53:07,233 --> 01:53:09,599 - What do you mean, you think it's a mixed ethnicity? 2363 01:53:09,736 --> 01:53:11,601 I don't understand. 2364 01:53:11,738 --> 01:53:13,603 - You said, "How is it that..." - That we're unique. 2365 01:53:13,740 --> 01:53:17,608 - "So many Americans kill each other?" 2366 01:53:17,744 --> 01:53:20,008 I don't know that that's true, but, uh... 2367 01:53:20,146 --> 01:53:21,511 - Well, no, you know that. 2368 01:53:21,648 --> 01:53:24,549 We know we have the highest murder rate with guns. 2369 01:53:24,684 --> 01:53:26,549 It's way higher than any other country. 2370 01:53:26,686 --> 01:53:30,053 - The only answer I can give you is the one I already gave you. 2371 01:53:30,189 --> 01:53:33,056 - Which is? - Which is that we have, uh... 2372 01:53:33,192 --> 01:53:36,059 - Historically-- - ...a history of violence. 2373 01:53:36,195 --> 01:53:39,562 Perhaps more than most countries. Not more than Russia, 2374 01:53:39,699 --> 01:53:42,566 not more than Japan or China-- - Not more than Germany. 2375 01:53:42,702 --> 01:53:47,196 - Not more than Germany, but certainly more than Canada. 2376 01:53:47,340 --> 01:53:50,070 - I come from Flint, Michigan, and last year, 2377 01:53:50,209 --> 01:53:53,076 a little six-year-old boy took a gun into a classroom 2378 01:53:53,212 --> 01:53:56,181 and shot and killed a six-year-old girl. And, uh... 2379 01:53:56,316 --> 01:53:58,511 it was really a tragic thing-- 2380 01:53:58,651 --> 01:54:01,620 - This was a kid, though. - A six-year-old, yeah. 2381 01:54:01,754 --> 01:54:03,187 Did you hear about this? 2382 01:54:03,323 --> 01:54:05,985 A six-year-old shooting a six-year-old? 2383 01:54:06,125 --> 01:54:07,558 - Yeah. - Well, here's my question. 2384 01:54:07,694 --> 01:54:08,592 After that happened, 2385 01:54:08,728 --> 01:54:10,593 you came to Flint and held a big rally. 2386 01:54:10,730 --> 01:54:12,095 - Mm-hm. 2387 01:54:12,231 --> 01:54:14,597 - And, you know, I just-- 2388 01:54:14,734 --> 01:54:17,100 - So did the vice-president. 2389 01:54:17,236 --> 01:54:20,103 - Yeah, but did you feel it was being at all insensitive 2390 01:54:20,239 --> 01:54:22,605 to the fact that this community had just gone through-- 2391 01:54:22,742 --> 01:54:25,540 - Actually, I wasn't aware of that at the time we came. 2392 01:54:25,678 --> 01:54:29,045 We came and did an early-morning, uh... rally, 2393 01:54:29,182 --> 01:54:31,047 then went on to wherever we were going. 2394 01:54:31,184 --> 01:54:34,051 - You didn't know at the time, that this killing had happened? 2395 01:54:34,187 --> 01:54:36,052 - No. - Had you known, would you have-- 2396 01:54:36,189 --> 01:54:38,054 - Would I have cancelled the... uh... 2397 01:54:38,191 --> 01:54:40,056 - Yeah. - I don't... 2398 01:54:40,193 --> 01:54:41,558 Hard to say. 2399 01:54:41,694 --> 01:54:43,559 - It wasn't like it was already planned. 2400 01:54:43,696 --> 01:54:45,561 I mean, the choice to come there was made 2401 01:54:45,698 --> 01:54:47,563 after this horrible killing took place. 2402 01:54:47,700 --> 01:54:49,065 - Yeah. Mm-hm. 2403 01:54:49,202 --> 01:54:52,069 - You know, had you know that, would you have come? 2404 01:54:52,205 --> 01:54:55,072 - I don't know. I have no idea. 2405 01:54:55,208 --> 01:54:57,199 - Maybe not. Maybe not. - Okay. Thank you. 2406 01:54:57,343 --> 01:55:00,574 - You think you'd like to just maybe apologize to the people 2407 01:55:00,713 --> 01:55:03,580 in Flint for coming and doing that at that time, or...? 2408 01:55:03,716 --> 01:55:05,581 - You want me to apologize... 2409 01:55:05,718 --> 01:55:07,583 me, apologize to the people in Flint? 2410 01:55:07,720 --> 01:55:09,620 - Or the people in Columbine 2411 01:55:09,756 --> 01:55:12,088 for coming after their horrible tragedy. 2412 01:55:12,225 --> 01:55:14,591 Why do you go to the places after they have 2413 01:55:14,727 --> 01:55:17,093 these horrible tragedies? I'm a member of your group here-- 2414 01:55:17,230 --> 01:55:20,097 - Well, I'm afraid we don't agree on... on that. 2415 01:55:20,233 --> 01:55:22,599 - You think it's okay to just come and show up 2416 01:55:22,735 --> 01:55:25,033 at these events. - No. 2417 01:55:25,171 --> 01:55:27,071 - You don't think it's okay? 2418 01:55:38,084 --> 01:55:40,780 Mr. Heston, just one more thing. 2419 01:55:40,920 --> 01:55:42,785 This is who she is - 2420 01:55:42,922 --> 01:55:45,516 or was. This is her. 2421 01:55:45,658 --> 01:55:47,523 Mr. Heston, please don't leave. 2422 01:55:47,660 --> 01:55:50,356 Mr. Heston, please, take a look at her. 2423 01:55:50,496 --> 01:55:53,090 This is the girl. 2424 01:56:44,150 --> 01:56:47,551 I left the Heston estate atop Beverly Hills 2425 01:56:47,687 --> 01:56:49,655 and walked back into the real world, 2426 01:56:49,789 --> 01:56:53,020 an America living and breathing in fear... 2427 01:56:53,159 --> 01:56:55,059 In your mind, you imagine somebody 2428 01:56:55,194 --> 01:56:58,061 who might break into your house, to harm you or your family. 2429 01:56:58,197 --> 01:57:01,564 What does that person look like? 2430 01:57:01,701 --> 01:57:04,534 - You. Her. Him. The camera guy, anybody. 2431 01:57:04,670 --> 01:57:07,036 Could be a gun in the camera, I don't know. 2432 01:57:07,173 --> 01:57:09,835 - Where gun sales were now at an all-time high... 2433 01:57:09,976 --> 01:57:13,070 - Can shoot as fast as Wesson semi-automatic. 2434 01:57:13,212 --> 01:57:15,180 - And where, in the end, 2435 01:57:15,314 --> 01:57:17,373 it all comes back to bowling 2436 01:57:17,517 --> 01:57:19,382 for Columbine. 2437 01:57:19,519 --> 01:57:22,044 - Three bowling-alley employees shot to death Sunday night 2438 01:57:22,188 --> 01:57:23,587 at the AMF Broadway Lanes. 2439 01:57:23,723 --> 01:57:26,521 - There's nothing I really know. I really don't know anything. 2440 01:57:26,659 --> 01:57:29,184 - Just that three people died. - Right. 2441 01:57:29,328 --> 01:57:30,852 - In Littleton, in a bowling alley. 2442 01:57:30,997 --> 01:57:32,555 I'm sorry. 2443 01:57:34,700 --> 01:57:37,965 Yes, it was a glorious time to be an American. 2444 01:57:43,843 --> 01:57:47,540 "I see trees of green 2445 01:57:47,680 --> 01:57:50,046 "Red roses too 2446 01:57:50,182 --> 01:57:53,049 "I see them bloom 2447 01:57:53,185 --> 01:57:55,050 "For me and you 2448 01:57:55,187 --> 01:57:59,055 "And I think to myself 2449 01:57:59,191 --> 01:58:02,592 "What a wonderful world 2450 01:58:06,699 --> 01:58:10,066 "I see skies of blue 2451 01:58:10,202 --> 01:58:13,069 "And clouds of white 2452 01:58:13,205 --> 01:58:15,571 "The bright sunny day 2453 01:58:15,708 --> 01:58:18,074 "The dark sacred night 2454 01:58:18,210 --> 01:58:22,078 "And I think to myself 2455 01:58:22,214 --> 01:58:25,547 "What a wonderful world 2456 01:58:30,156 --> 01:58:32,021 "The colours of the rainbow 2457 01:58:32,158 --> 01:58:35,525 "All so pretty in the sky 2458 01:58:35,661 --> 01:58:38,027 "Are also on the faces 2459 01:58:38,164 --> 01:58:40,530 "Of the people walking by 2460 01:58:40,666 --> 01:58:43,533 "I see friends shakin' hands 2461 01:58:43,669 --> 01:58:47,036 "Sayin' How do you do 2462 01:58:47,173 --> 01:58:50,040 "They're really saying 2463 01:58:50,176 --> 01:58:52,041 "I love you 2464 01:58:52,178 --> 01:58:56,046 "I see babies cryin' 2465 01:58:56,182 --> 01:58:58,548 "I watch them grow 2466 01:58:58,684 --> 01:59:00,549 "They'll learn much more 2467 01:59:00,686 --> 01:59:03,553 "Than I'll ever know 2468 01:59:03,689 --> 01:59:07,557 "And I think to myself 2469 01:59:07,693 --> 01:59:11,094 "What a wonderful world 2470 01:59:15,201 --> 01:59:19,069 "And I think to myself 2471 01:59:19,205 --> 01:59:22,606 "What a wonderful world... 2472 01:59:32,218 --> 01:59:36,120 "And I say to myself 2473 01:59:40,226 --> 01:59:44,094 "What a wonderful 2474 01:59:44,230 --> 01:59:46,858 "World"